Apple responds to "I'm a PC" • Hacker News Board

Re: Apple responds to "I'm a PC"

#41

Post by ratsbane » Mon, Oct 20, 2008, 2:00 PM UTC

cbrinker wrote: post #13

LPTS wrote: post #3

Brilliant. I love the look on Macs face when he swoops the ad money towards fixing vista and PC swoops it toward advertising. This is like boxing. Mac ads have had pc's reputation on the ropes in the collective unconscious. All the sudden, after getting beat on barely throwing a punch, PC comes out swinging. Even lands a blow on macs chin, shakes him up a bit. But before PC can land another punch, this uppercut takes…

"Mac ads have had pc's reputation on the ropes in the collective unconscious." Do you mean Microsoft? If so, it sure as hell hasn't scratched the business world. It's only knicked the consumer world a couple percentage points. I'd reconsider your position. Further, this is kind of old and becoming a nonissue in today's world. With the migration towards non-platform-specific consumer usage of systems (ie. internet) I…

There's a lot more to it than just "Apple is just a gimmick..." OS X is unix and unix is the real rising star here. Apple just had the good sense to catch a ride on the bandwagon of that rising star and the competence to do a very good job of it. Apple's market share is still small but it's been growing steadily for years. Today's rate-of-change is tomorrow's level.

Re: Apple responds to "I'm a PC"

#42

Post by ratsbane » Mon, Oct 20, 2008, 2:01 PM UTC

ratsbane wrote: post #41

cbrinker wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Mac ads have had pc's reputation on the ropes in the collective unconscious." Do you mean Microsoft? If so, it sure as hell hasn't scratched the business world. It's only knicked the consumer world a couple percentage points. I'd reconsider your position. Further, this is kind of old and becoming a nonissue in today's world. With the migration towards non-platform-specific consumer usage of systems (ie. internet) I…

There's a lot more to it than just "Apple is just a gimmick..." OS X is unix and unix is the real rising star here. Apple just had the good sense to catch a ride on the bandwagon of that rising star and the competence to do a very good job of it. Apple's market share is still small but it's been growing steadily for years. Today's rate-of-change is tomorrow's level.

"bandwagon of that rising star..."

Good grief.

Re: Apple responds to "I'm a PC"

#43

Post by briansmith » Mon, Oct 20, 2008, 2:13 PM UTC

ratsbane wrote: post #40

visitor4rmindia wrote: post #11

When did advertisments become about putting your competitor down? Heck even the Coke v/s Pepsi wars didn't stoop this low. If Apple can't market it's products on their own features and has to rely on this kind of negative adverts I'd say it's really hitting a low-point. The ad kind of pisses me off actually.

I liked it. It isn't mean at all. It's lighthearted and funny but it does address something I've thought about before. Perhaps Vista isn't as bad as most people think but it certainly does have problems. Instead earnestly promising to address any real issues Microsoft announced a $300m ad campaign to deal with it. MS could have earned a lot more credibility and respect by admitting to perhaps even a small sampling of…

What parts of Vista need to be fixed?

Re: Apple responds to "I'm a PC"

#44

Post by briansmith » Mon, Oct 20, 2008, 2:15 PM UTC

raganwald wrote: post #29

whatusername wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you look at Win7 as "Fixing Vista" --> which in some/lots of ways it is - then I'd guess that MS are spending more on "fixing" than on advertising.. Certainly nothing near that ratio though.. The reasonably insightful comment on reddit was that this isn't just a pissing contest between MS and Apple - it's a pissing contest between Crispin Porter and TBWA (the ad agencies)...

If you look at Win7 as "Fixing Vista" --> which in some/lots of ways it is - then I'd guess that MS are spending more on "fixing" than on advertising I considered that argument, but note that they are still pushing Vista to consumers and businesses, hard. So I think the ad is fair in that it discusses what MSFT is doing to Vista itself. If MSFT's $300 million was spent telling consumers to hang onto XP and wait for W…

What exactly is wrong with Windows Vista? I actually want to get Vista so I can get UAC.

Re: Apple responds to "I'm a PC"

#45

Post by rkowalick » Mon, Oct 20, 2008, 2:20 PM UTC

mixmax wrote: post #7

Now if apple would only realise that quicktime on the net has lost out to flash I would be able to wacth this. Quicktime reminds me of realplayer: buggy on PC's, runs lots of processes in the background I didn't ask for and requires me to install itunes which I don't want.

You can always use mplayer for windows

Re: Apple responds to "I'm a PC"

#46

Post by raganwald » Mon, Oct 20, 2008, 2:22 PM UTC

briansmith wrote: post #44

raganwald wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you look at Win7 as "Fixing Vista" --> which in some/lots of ways it is - then I'd guess that MS are spending more on "fixing" than on advertising I considered that argument, but note that they are still pushing Vista to consumers and businesses, hard. So I think the ad is fair in that it discusses what MSFT is doing to Vista itself. If MSFT's $300 million was spent telling consumers to hang onto XP and wait for W…

What exactly is wrong with Windows Vista? I actually want to get Vista so I can get UAC.

Well, if you feel that Vista is wonderful, then it is reasonable for you to argue that Apple's ad is not factually correct. Such a view mirrors what MSFT's PR people are saying, namely that Vista is fine but for some reason the marketplace hasn't grasped why they should prefer it to XP or OS X.

So... if you believe that the problem with Vista is its perception, then of course the solution is communication, not code. Entirely reasonable if you start with the premise that it's a fine piece of engineering and a good product.

Re: Apple responds to "I'm a PC"

#47

Post by boredguy8 » Mon, Oct 20, 2008, 2:33 PM UTC

turtle_2 wrote: post #33

cbrinker wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Mac ads have had pc's reputation on the ropes in the collective unconscious." Do you mean Microsoft? If so, it sure as hell hasn't scratched the business world. It's only knicked the consumer world a couple percentage points. I'd reconsider your position. Further, this is kind of old and becoming a nonissue in today's world. With the migration towards non-platform-specific consumer usage of systems (ie. internet) I…

Put a noose around its neck, huh? Jobs returned to Apple and changed its direction about 10 years ago. - Go to: http://finance.google.com/finance?q=AAPL - Click the 10 yr time frame. - Click the check box to add MSFT to the same graph. - Tell me again how bad of a job Steve has been doing, and how it hasn't meant anything to MSFT. Now some more ycombinator specific points. When you get together with a bunch of web st…

It hasn't. Microsoft's growth has remained relatively stable since it's growth from '95 to 2000. Apple has almost zero impact from '98 to 2005, which is where we start to see the stock perform well.

Re: Apple responds to "I'm a PC"

#48

Post by raganwald » Mon, Oct 20, 2008, 2:34 PM UTC

whatusername wrote: post #15

raganwald wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm reminded of what Charlton Heston said to Bill Maher. Charlton had taken out full page personal attack ads blasting Barbara Streisand for her anti-gun activism, and Bill Maher asked him if this was really appropriate. Charlton considered for a moment, and then responded. I was unkind , he admitted, Not unfair, but unkind. Now as to lame, is it there some factual error? Is Microsoft actually spending more on fixing…

If you look at Win7 as "Fixing Vista" --> which in some/lots of ways it is - then I'd guess that MS are spending more on "fixing" than on advertising.. Certainly nothing near that ratio though.. The reasonably insightful comment on reddit was that this isn't just a pissing contest between MS and Apple - it's a pissing contest between Crispin Porter and TBWA (the ad agencies)...

The reasonably insightful comment on reddit was that this isn't just a pissing contest between MS and Apple - it's a pissing contest between Crispin Porter and TBWA (the ad agencies)...

I think one has the more appealing product to market, the other has the bigger budget and the defensive position. It's a fairly textbook marketing battle between the entrenched number one and the upstart niche player.

Re: Apple responds to "I'm a PC"

#49

Post by thomasmallen » Mon, Oct 20, 2008, 2:36 PM UTC

Jem wrote: post #35

rbanffy wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you be more specific on why you hated every minute of it?

Well, it's been a while, but let's see what I can remember! I think, the fact that: * I had to re-map certain keys on my keyboard just to get a usable # key/'real' British keyboard layout - it ultimately meant I had keys labelled as one thing that did another (thankfully I touch type) * Pressing Apple + C or Apple + Z meant forcing my hand in to uncomfortable, unnatural positions - I prefer the spacing on a standard…

When tab doesn't work, Control + Tab usually does. I think Mac programs make up for less tabbing by having far more keyboard shortcuts.

Re: Apple responds to "I'm a PC"

#50

Post by commandar » Mon, Oct 20, 2008, 2:42 PM UTC

Jem wrote: post #35

rbanffy wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you be more specific on why you hated every minute of it?

Well, it's been a while, but let's see what I can remember! I think, the fact that: * I had to re-map certain keys on my keyboard just to get a usable # key/'real' British keyboard layout - it ultimately meant I had keys labelled as one thing that did another (thankfully I touch type) * Pressing Apple + C or Apple + Z meant forcing my hand in to uncomfortable, unnatural positions - I prefer the spacing on a standard…

* Pressing Apple + C or Apple + Z meant forcing my hand in to uncomfortable, unnatural positions - I prefer the spacing on a standard PC keyboard between Ctrl + C/etc*

Huh? I'm pretty platform agnostic, but I've always liked this about the Mac. The Command key can be held down my shifting my thumb to the left of the spacebar and I can copy+paste without ever pulling my hands off the home row. Trying to hold control with my pinky and twist around to hit various key combos always felt more like a contortionist act to me.