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South Asian people undergo type 2 diabetes remission with low calorie diets

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Re: South Asian people undergo type 2 diabetes remission with low calorie diets

#21

Post by wincy »

knaik94 wrote: post #20

The amount of calories per day caught my attention, 850kcal/day with diet replacement products. I understand that with medical supervision, there is less risk of malnourishment or nutrients deficiencies. The general advice, even from my primary care physician, has been that anything less than 1200kcal/day is dangerous and is crash dieting. Looking around, I found this other study studying total diet replacement provi…

Interesting, when I lost 80 pounds doing a ketogenic diet my appetite leveled off at exactly 1200 calories per day. I wasn’t counting calories out of anything other than curiosity as I was losing weight anyway. Getting even lower would have been pretty difficult.

Re: South Asian people undergo type 2 diabetes remission with low calorie diets

#22

Post by CyberDildonics »

JPLeRouzic wrote: post #7
wrycoder wrote: post #2

Isn’t this obvious?

> Isn’t this obvious? Please consider wondering why no doctors/scientist know how to heal people with diabetes. Do they miss something obvious?

Robert Lustig has been giving the same presentation for over a decade showing statistics that people who stop eating sugar can reverse their type 2 diabetes.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dBnniua6-oM

Re: South Asian people undergo type 2 diabetes remission with low calorie diets

#23

Post by adrian_b »

0xcde4c3db wrote: post #16
lhl wrote: post #6

There's a long history of studies showing Low-Calorie Diets as being effective for reversing T2D. The late Sarah Hallberg wrote a narrative review that I liked a lot a couple years back (see section 3.2 for the part on LCDs): https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6520897/ Hallberg SJ, Gershuni VM, Hazbun TL, Athinarayanan SJ. Reversing Type 2 Diabetes: A Narrative Review of the Evidence. Nutrients. 2019 Apr 1;…

> Furthermore, long-term achievement of diabetes remission, adherence to the diet, and weight loss maintenance after the diet remain a challenge. Studies have also suggested that physiological and metabolic adaptation of the body in response to caloric restriction may shift energy balance and hormonal regulation of weight toward weight regain after weight loss [67,68]. Thus, it is crucial that future studies are dire…

Seeing that there are more than 10 thousand US people in that database, which is unlikely to be complete, I do not think that "hardly anyone" is the right term.

Nevertheless, I agree that such people might be a very small part of those who lose weight.

About 15 years ago, I have lost about one third of my initial body weight during almost a year, and then I have kept my desired weight until today, without any kind of medical treatment, either surgical or drug-based.

Nevertheless it was not easy and it required a lot of thought and experiments with the diet, until I have learned how to control my weight, after many years during which I had believed that this is impossible. It also required completely dropping many bad habits, for example drinking commercial juices or eating commercial mixes of yogurt with fruits or eating various kinds of "breakfast cereals" or any other such commercial products containing an excessive amount of sugar. I have never eaten or drunk again any of the products that I have blacklisted, even if they were among those that I had eaten or drunk daily, for many years.

I believe that most people are not introspective enough to succeed in changing so much their habits by themselves so they need some kind of external help. The main obstacles for weight control are psychological, not physiological, i.e. those who need to control their weight must learn somehow to love to eat food that is different from what they had been eating, because if they will ever revert to their old eating style, then they will certainly also revert to their previous weight.

Re: South Asian people undergo type 2 diabetes remission with low calorie diets

#24

Post by mmmpop »

wincy wrote: post #21
knaik94 wrote: post #20

The amount of calories per day caught my attention, 850kcal/day with diet replacement products. I understand that with medical supervision, there is less risk of malnourishment or nutrients deficiencies. The general advice, even from my primary care physician, has been that anything less than 1200kcal/day is dangerous and is crash dieting. Looking around, I found this other study studying total diet replacement provi…

Interesting, when I lost 80 pounds doing a ketogenic diet my appetite leveled off at exactly 1200 calories per day. I wasn’t counting calories out of anything other than curiosity as I was losing weight anyway. Getting even lower would have been pretty difficult.

I did a lot of ketogenic diets when I was younger in an attempt to shed all of the weight that comes with being raised in Appalachia. It was my experience that it was a great kickstart to a weight-loss plan for someone who was at rock-bottom health and needed fast results while not feeling like you're starving.

But I feel like it taught me to be bored with eating, and to establish a more healthy relationship with food. High-fat, mid-protein, low-carb sounds terrific for the first day or two but once you're two weeks in, you're so sick of it all that you'd just as soon drink some water and get back to whatever you're doing.

Re: South Asian people undergo type 2 diabetes remission with low calorie diets

#25

Post by ramraj07 »

chrisgd wrote: post #18

I read a transcript of an endocrinologist suggesting intermittent fasting (don’t eat after 6 and wait as long as you can before your first meal - start with 10am and keep pushing back as long as you can). Then eat only veggies for your first meal, then veggies and a deck of cards serving of meat for dinner. Honestly, it sounds very difficult, but the doctor seemed very confident that this works. I have started trying…

The consensus from the most sensible people is, do the diet you can stick to, in the end just eat less. That’s most important.

Re: South Asian people undergo type 2 diabetes remission with low calorie diets

#26

Post by chrisgd »

ramraj07 wrote: post #25
chrisgd wrote: post #18

I read a transcript of an endocrinologist suggesting intermittent fasting (don’t eat after 6 and wait as long as you can before your first meal - start with 10am and keep pushing back as long as you can). Then eat only veggies for your first meal, then veggies and a deck of cards serving of meat for dinner. Honestly, it sounds very difficult, but the doctor seemed very confident that this works. I have started trying…

The consensus from the most sensible people is, do the diet you can stick to, in the end just eat less. That’s most important.

Not sure I agree

Re: South Asian people undergo type 2 diabetes remission with low calorie diets

#27

Post by wincy »

mmmpop wrote: post #24
wincy wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Interesting, when I lost 80 pounds doing a ketogenic diet my appetite leveled off at exactly 1200 calories per day. I wasn’t counting calories out of anything other than curiosity as I was losing weight anyway. Getting even lower would have been pretty difficult.

I did a lot of ketogenic diets when I was younger in an attempt to shed all of the weight that comes with being raised in Appalachia. It was my experience that it was a great kickstart to a weight-loss plan for someone who was at rock-bottom health and needed fast results while not feeling like you're starving. But I feel like it taught me to be bored with eating, and to establish a more healthy relationship with foo…

Well I mean it worked for me because if I eat sugar I end up consuming something on the order of 4000+ calories per day. Something about carbohydrates makes me absolutely ravenous for sugars.

Also if I don’t eat right as I feel hungry I’ll feel as if someone has gut punched me. I get absurdly hungry.

Re: South Asian people undergo type 2 diabetes remission with low calorie diets

#28

Post by Vt71fcAqt7 »

PuppyTailWags wrote: post #17
Vt71fcAqt7 wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While not exactly obvious, this has been known for a while now. It even became the position statement of the American College of Lifestyle Medicine to restrict calories as a way to induce remission: > Studies with therapeutic dosing typically used very low energy diets (600-1100 kcal/day) with a weighted mean remission rate of 49.4%, while studies with subtherapeutic dosing typically used more moderate caloric restri…

Wait, how long are people expected to be on 600-1100 kcal/day? Just for a little worse than a coin flip? That sounds really miserable. Isn't that basically a crash diet and no one stfus about not doing those because they can mess you up long term? I'm really confused how T2D are special such that crash dieting doesn't mess them up further and put them further in a hole. They're already messed up because of the T2D, a…

VLCDs are very safe, much safer than say all the co-morbidities of obesity. The important thing is to chose the right things to eat for those few calories. It also assumes a sedantary office lifestyle with only minimal exercise. If you work out or run you will need more. With these caveats it is safe and effective and works for obesity, type-2 diabetes and some metabolism problems.

It really is that simple. The first law of thermodynamics doesn't go away so simply. Combine that with the evolutionary preassure that favors those who can save and expend energy and this all makes perfect sense. For example, increased insulin sensitivity on a low calorie diet makes sense evolutionarily. The only drawback is that muscle will be consumed as well. The amount varries by person, diet and exercise but it is minimal with a high protien diet. So say eating 500 kcal of chicken brest everyday and the rest of the calories spilt between carbs and lipids would be a good way to do this diet.

"Crash diets" do work as long as you do it for a few months. People generaly do a few days and then start binging >200 TDEE. Obviously that won't work:

>The active stage is characterized by a very low-calorie diet (600–800 kcal/day), low in carbohydrates ([0]

[0]The management of very low-calorie ketogenic diet in obesity outpatient clinic: a practical guide (2019)

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6820992/

Re: South Asian people undergo type 2 diabetes remission with low calorie diets

#29

Post by adrian_b »

chrisgd wrote: post #18

I read a transcript of an endocrinologist suggesting intermittent fasting (don’t eat after 6 and wait as long as you can before your first meal - start with 10am and keep pushing back as long as you can). Then eat only veggies for your first meal, then veggies and a deck of cards serving of meat for dinner. Honestly, it sounds very difficult, but the doctor seemed very confident that this works. I have started trying…

When losing weight, it is important to continue to eat a normal amount of proteins, essential fatty acids, vitamins and minerals.

Only either the carbohydrates or the (non-essential) fats or both must be reduced. It does not matter which of them is reduced, as long as the total calorie amount is restricted enough. It may matter only due to personal preferences, which may make one variant or the other easier to support.

One must use some digital scales for measuring the weight every day at precisely the same moment, because the weight varies during a day by much more than the difference between 2 successive days. An appropriate rate of losing weight is between 100 grams and 200 grams per day, e.g. about 1 kg per week. If the measurements show another rate, then the amount of daily food must be increased or decreased until the rate is in range.

Regardless with which diet you start, if you adjust the amount of carbohydrates and fat according to the daily weight measurements, in a week or so you will converge to the right amount of daily food. However, this requires to measure by mass or by volume all the food eaten. Those who do not succeed to lose weight fail because they either do not measure what they eat or they cannot abstain from eating more than what they have planned to eat.

Losing the weight is the easier part. More important is to plan a diet for after reaching the target weight, a diet that will keep the weight constant, i.e. which must still be calorie-restricted, but at a normal level, and which must be appealing enough, so that one would never be tempted to eat again in the way that caused the overweight in the beginning.

Re: South Asian people undergo type 2 diabetes remission with low calorie diets

#30

Post by yazaddaruvala »

chrisgd wrote: post #18

I read a transcript of an endocrinologist suggesting intermittent fasting (don’t eat after 6 and wait as long as you can before your first meal - start with 10am and keep pushing back as long as you can). Then eat only veggies for your first meal, then veggies and a deck of cards serving of meat for dinner. Honestly, it sounds very difficult, but the doctor seemed very confident that this works. I have started trying…

> Then eat only veggies for your first meal, then veggies and a deck of cards serving of meat for dinner.

> lot of people have suggested keto and low-carb diets

Just always remember: while rice, pasta and bread are vegetarian they are not vegetables.

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