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U.S. bans equipment from Huawei and ZTE, citing national security concerns

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Re: U.S. bans equipment from Huawei and ZTE, citing national security concerns

#161

Post by l33t233372 »

blurbleblurble wrote: post #144

Why are the stakes so high? Well, research "integrated communications and sensing" to find out. IEEE is pushing this paradigm shift. The radio hardware isn't just being used for communications between active devices anymore. It'll be useable for passive and biometric sensing applications, including but not limited to passive localization and identification of people without phones. Next generation wireless standards…

> reason I doubt that hardware deployed in the 5 eyes nations won't also be used for surveillance purposes

Well that makes sense. They didn’t cite privacy concerns.

Re: U.S. bans equipment from Huawei and ZTE, citing national security concerns

#162

Post by b112 »

DiogenesKynikos wrote: post #102
rgbrenner wrote: post #28

Reminder of how this started... when Huawei and ZTE decided that because they weren't American companies, they didnt need to answer questions from Congress, and even outright lied about the structure of their companies to conceal CPC/government involvement: https://stacks.stanford.edu/file/druid:rm226yb7473/Huawei-ZT...

This is a very detailed examination of Huawei's ownership structure: [0]. It was written after claims that Huawei is secretly state-owned. The author goes into some detail about Chinese corporate law, and shows that Huawei is effectively employee-owned ( effectively , because Chinese corporate law limits the numbers of shareholders in private companies, so there is a legal structure that holds shares on behalf of emp…

Seems weird that people would think "secret ownership" would be public, about a company located in China, which controls ownership info.

That said, what is on the books is irrelevant, if the senior staff are in the pocket of the PRC. Or, you know, their entire family is under threat, a common way to compel in China.

Re: U.S. bans equipment from Huawei and ZTE, citing national security concerns

#163

Post by factsarelolz »

nine_k wrote: post #146
paganel wrote: post #139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> in celebration of a great professional victory, At first I was intrigued about why did that guy call all this industrial protectionism act as something "professional", afterwards I saw that he is an active part of the industrial defence complex (he's a National Security Council staffer), so that started to make a little bit more sense. I'm wondering though for how long will the MIC ghouls continue to have the upper…

Maybe this may help US manufacturers get better deals. But I see it as a side effect. The main effect is that we should not buy key communication equipment from a country we cannot trust . Its government can strongarm any of its business entities to comply with its orders, and these orders are not going to be friendly to the US. It's a bit like buying communication equipment from the USSR. Maybe the equipment is fine…

> The main effect is that we should not buy key communication equipment from a country we cannot trust.

We should not buy anything that is internet connected from a country we cannot trust.

Re: U.S. bans equipment from Huawei and ZTE, citing national security concerns

#164

Post by nazgulsenpai »

javajosh wrote: post #110
nazgulsenpai wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ouch, I own a few of these cameras. I chose Amcrest because they have a local US distributer who does all of the technical/warranty support. Interesting.

Why ouch? If they are local-only the max mischief they might cause is relatively limited, right? Or do you suspect them of phoning home behind your back?

I haven't seen any unusual communication from any installed, but they're all firewalled and with WAN disallowed. The ouch was because I will have to find another vendor if they are no longer allowed to be sold in the US.

Re: U.S. bans equipment from Huawei and ZTE, citing national security concerns

#165

Post by cscurmudgeon »

chitowneats wrote: post #149
throwaway4good wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is just appalling protectionism; is it really something that we tech people should cheer on?

You're falling into the trap they've laid for us. They screw us with protectionism, then when we respond, they cheekily say, "You're violating your values! You can't do that!" Most Ukrainians don't want to kill Russians, but they were attacked. "Fight back" and "surrender" are the only two options.

Remember, it is okay to be intolerant of intolerance. To be tolerant, you need to have a threshold for not tolerating intolerance. Protectionism is a form of intolerance.

Re: U.S. bans equipment from Huawei and ZTE, citing national security concerns

#166

Post by bogomipz »

blurbleblurble wrote: post #144

Why are the stakes so high? Well, research "integrated communications and sensing" to find out. IEEE is pushing this paradigm shift. The radio hardware isn't just being used for communications between active devices anymore. It'll be useable for passive and biometric sensing applications, including but not limited to passive localization and identification of people without phones. Next generation wireless standards…

Could you elaborate on what exactly "integrated communications and sensing" is and why it's so important here. I tried to do some quick reading but I failed to find any good high level overview of what it is. Most of what I was able to find seemed like academic research papers around beam-forming.

Re: U.S. bans equipment from Huawei and ZTE, citing national security concerns

#167

Post by rightbyte »

blurbleblurble wrote: post #144

Why are the stakes so high? Well, research "integrated communications and sensing" to find out. IEEE is pushing this paradigm shift. The radio hardware isn't just being used for communications between active devices anymore. It'll be useable for passive and biometric sensing applications, including but not limited to passive localization and identification of people without phones. Next generation wireless standards…

> It'll be useable for passive and biometric sensing applications, including but not limited to passive localization and identification of people without phones.

What? How? Why are all these tinfoil hat conspiracies turning into reality ... like your TV or alarm clock spying on you.

Re: U.S. bans equipment from Huawei and ZTE, citing national security concerns

#168

Post by dilyevsky »

throwaway4good wrote: post #150
dmix wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not using it government/critical telecom makes sense but other but a general rule seems like a big overreach.

The US campaign against Huawei and ZTE caused the 5G rollout in the west, including here in Europe, to be considerably delayed and much more expensive.

I participated in technical due diligence for a purchase order of huawei tech back in 2011 (was lte back then). Their tech was good but there is no way in hell there isn’t some kind of trick how cheap they were compared to the europeans (there were no americans at that point since motorola was kaput). Like it was basically free. There needs to be some kind of regulation when techniques like that are being played whether it’s security or just economic concerns

Re: U.S. bans equipment from Huawei and ZTE, citing national security concerns

#169

Post by wankerrific »

throwaway4good wrote: post #150
dmix wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not using it government/critical telecom makes sense but other but a general rule seems like a big overreach.

The US campaign against Huawei and ZTE caused the 5G rollout in the west, including here in Europe, to be considerably delayed and much more expensive.

These companies are famous for price dumping as well. This ban is a good thing

Re: U.S. bans equipment from Huawei and ZTE, citing national security concerns

#170

Post by stefan_ »

somenameforme wrote: post #112
dingi wrote: post #32

Whe you consider China's restrictions against US companies, these things are a drop in a bucket.

What would you say is the best example? I'm aware China does aggressively censor US media type products that don't toe the Chinese worldview, but I'm less familiar with absolute bans of major companies of this sort. I may be misreading the situation here, but to me this seems like a rather extreme escalation that would be analogous to China banning e.g. Apple or Google based/created devices after questioning them ove…

For the longest time companies could simply not operate in China at all other than through some majority Chinese joint-venture.
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