Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Banks and hospitals are cashing in when patients can't pay for health care

text.npr.org

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

61–70 of 104 posts

Re: Banks and hospitals are cashing in when patients can't pay for health care

#61

Post by stevebmark »

mistrial9 wrote: post #54
stevebmark wrote: post #44

Great article. It’s important to understand that hospitals are the enemy in American healthcare. (All of its layers are the enemy, but hospitals are often overlooked). Many hospitals are viscous for-profit machines that fraudulently maintain a non-profit status. They employ CFOs and business analysts to maximize profits unrelated to care quality. They hire “medical coders” whose entire job is to find the highest pric…

> that hospitals are the enemy in American healthcare no, not every hospital is run this way. Many are, of course.. how can constructive engagement get past these shrill and urgent criticisms, and make positive change?

The article calls out hospitals engaging in predatory lending. I called out non-profit status as fraud, medical coders, room fees, and financial officers taking over hospitals. I think there's plenty to change here. I'm happy to come off as shrill in exchange for awareness. I'm also not sure what the negativity is around urgency.

Re: Banks and hospitals are cashing in when patients can't pay for health care

#62

Post by christophilus »

kelseyfrog wrote: post #49
AlexTWithBeard wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So... Imagine there's a law banning surprise bills. No longer separate bills from a hospital and then from a surgeon and then from anesthesiologist and then from the janitor. No "oopsie, sorry, your pimple removal went wrong and you had a cardiac arrest, here's your bill". How much better will things become?

A law? How come hospitals and doctors that don't have surprise bills out-compete those that do? Surely if this was a thing that patients cum customers demanded, there would be a provider willing to step in an supply it.

Healthcare in the US is a broken market due to regulatory capture among other things. If Buffett and Bezos and Dimon couldn’t solve it, it’s probably not going to be solved without the government breaking up the cartel. That’s a valid function of government even by fairly libertarian standards.

Re: Banks and hospitals are cashing in when patients can't pay for health care

#63

Post by pessimizer »

mistrial9 wrote: post #54
stevebmark wrote: post #44

Great article. It’s important to understand that hospitals are the enemy in American healthcare. (All of its layers are the enemy, but hospitals are often overlooked). Many hospitals are viscous for-profit machines that fraudulently maintain a non-profit status. They employ CFOs and business analysts to maximize profits unrelated to care quality. They hire “medical coders” whose entire job is to find the highest pric…

> that hospitals are the enemy in American healthcare no, not every hospital is run this way. Many are, of course.. how can constructive engagement get past these shrill and urgent criticisms, and make positive change?

This comment has no content other than an empty insult against the comment it is replying to. How can it be considered constructive? I choose shrill and urgent criticisms over vacuity any day.

Re: Banks and hospitals are cashing in when patients can't pay for health care

#64

Post by yamtaddle »

mistrial9 wrote: post #54
stevebmark wrote: post #44

Great article. It’s important to understand that hospitals are the enemy in American healthcare. (All of its layers are the enemy, but hospitals are often overlooked). Many hospitals are viscous for-profit machines that fraudulently maintain a non-profit status. They employ CFOs and business analysts to maximize profits unrelated to care quality. They hire “medical coders” whose entire job is to find the highest pric…

> that hospitals are the enemy in American healthcare no, not every hospital is run this way. Many are, of course.. how can constructive engagement get past these shrill and urgent criticisms, and make positive change?

The US medical system is a giant gaping stab wound on our economy and society. Shrill and urgent criticism is the minimum kind of reaction it should be drawing. And yes, basically every part of it is very much to blame, including hospitals.

Re: Banks and hospitals are cashing in when patients can't pay for health care

#65

Post by pessimizer »

lotsofpulp wrote: post #15
svnt wrote: post #6

If you are bragging about your margins while the alternative for your customers is death or a major chronic health issue, it no longer matters if it is malice or incompetence. It is structurally and functionally evil.

How about people opting to choose non healthcare careers due to better pay to quality of life at work ratios?

Quiz: Does raising margins for a hospital raise or lower the pay and quality of life for the people who work in it?

Hint: the people who work in a hospital are an expense.

Re: Banks and hospitals are cashing in when patients can't pay for health care

#66

Post by pessimizer »

hungryforcodes wrote: post #32
delecti wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Two things can be bad.

That's true -- but in this case there is an irrational bias. The people on HN who criticize crypto obviously don't invest in it and have no skin in the game. They just want to feel superior. But it doesn't affect them at all. But this really could -- and yet they are silent...

> yet they are silent...

No they're not.

Re: Banks and hospitals are cashing in when patients can't pay for health care

#67

Post by JamesBarney »

elzbardico wrote: post #7

What is incredibly amazing is how much health care costs in the US. Government expenditures Per Capita are over twice of the nations like Canada, UK, Australia, and Japan. And most of this for medicare, for which only a fraction of the population is eligible. And yet, this is not enough, and people need private health insurance. Then you look at the prices of common medications, and most of them (mind you, a lot of t…

The reason medication is expensive is the FDA makes its crazy expensive to bring a drug to market. And the U.S. basically subsidizes the rest of the world's drug research.

If the U.S. paid what the rest of world did for drugs there would be a 90% less drug research.

Re: Banks and hospitals are cashing in when patients can't pay for health care

#68

Post by mgkimsal »

theGnuMe wrote: post #42
starkd wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In no way is this a free market. Not even close. There are so many market distortions that prevent a healthy market place from operating. If you recall, the ACA act was supposed to help solve many of these problems by making it more affordable. It appears to have exacerbated it.

ACA increases the subscriber pool. The main issue now is the high deductibles which causes folks to ration care. Otherwise your premiums are scaled based on income. You also do get some primary care visits included and a few other things. That's so you catch things earlier before they get expensive. What the ACA really does though, is reduce the financial impact of a catastrophic event. So you are covered and out of…

Assuming that 10 or 100k of services is 'in network'. The only plan I can remotely afford now offers no functionality in any 'out of network' facility. The columns are all just 'n/a'.

Re: Banks and hospitals are cashing in when patients can't pay for health care

#69

Post by JamesBarney »

starkd wrote: post #8
elzbardico wrote: post #7

What is incredibly amazing is how much health care costs in the US. Government expenditures Per Capita are over twice of the nations like Canada, UK, Australia, and Japan. And most of this for medicare, for which only a fraction of the population is eligible. And yet, this is not enough, and people need private health insurance. Then you look at the prices of common medications, and most of them (mind you, a lot of t…

In no way is this a free market. Not even close. There are so many market distortions that prevent a healthy market place from operating. If you recall, the ACA act was supposed to help solve many of these problems by making it more affordable. It appears to have exacerbated it.

I don't think there is any evidence it exacerbated it.

Re: Banks and hospitals are cashing in when patients can't pay for health care

#70

Post by yamtaddle »

zdragnar wrote: post #28
elzbardico wrote: post #7

What is incredibly amazing is how much health care costs in the US. Government expenditures Per Capita are over twice of the nations like Canada, UK, Australia, and Japan. And most of this for medicare, for which only a fraction of the population is eligible. And yet, this is not enough, and people need private health insurance. Then you look at the prices of common medications, and most of them (mind you, a lot of t…

An interesting story I heard on the radio: A father got a call from his daughter that she went to the emergency room, because she had a vitamin C pill stuck in her throat and she was scared. In NY, they are required to give an estimate of costs, and estimated $1600 for the exam and the can of ginger ale they gave her to drink so she could swallow it. Fast forward a few weeks, and they got the bill. They ended up char…

Regardless of whether they can ultimately fix the problem, bringing regulators and/or state legislators into the conversation is often enough to make providers and insurers get a lot more reasonable (I mean, the figures involved still won't actually be reasonable, but more reasonable, at least) in a hurry, because regulators and legislators are annoying enough to deal with that they'd really rather not.

But all of this means you're probably gonna lose the equivalent of a work week or two of hours playing go-between with everyone involved, largely sitting on hold on hospital billing department and insurer phone lines. Record everything because they all have a habit of "losing" their own fucking records. Reference numbers aren't enough, they'll say they can't find it—record the calls (check your state laws and make sure you comply, which may require nothing in some states, or may require your notifying each person who comes on the line in others)

Post reply on HN