Live data from Hacker News

Tesla has used space characters in internal emails to identify leaks

twitter.com

341–350 of 448 posts

Re: Tesla has used space characters in internal emails to identify leaks

#341

Years ago, I worked at a place that attempted this. They were so giddy about it. There wasn’t even a known leak, or, arguably, anything particularly worth leaking. They were just tickled by the idea that they could gotcha anyone who tried to leak something. Then, as now, it strikes me as little more than sad and paranoid Tom Clancy cosplay. I’d like to say I’ve moved on to a place with a culture of trust and faithful…

Stick the email into Google Translate, translate to Spanish and back, correcting any major mis-translations and Juan is your uncle .

Or put your own space noise in the message to frame a coworker.

Re: Tesla has used space characters in internal emails to identify leaks

#342

Years ago, I worked at a place that attempted this. They were so giddy about it. There wasn’t even a known leak, or, arguably, anything particularly worth leaking. They were just tickled by the idea that they could gotcha anyone who tried to leak something. Then, as now, it strikes me as little more than sad and paranoid Tom Clancy cosplay. I’d like to say I’ve moved on to a place with a culture of trust and faithful…

Yet I can't really fault a company for trying to hold people accountable for breaking their terms of employment.

Employees should be responsible and have a duty to their employer. But it's important to decide if enforcement is appropriate and helpful. It hurts employee morale to be distrusted like this.

If the secrets being guarded are life or death for the company, then some extra measures may be appropriate. But if they're normal corporate "secrets" the harms of enforcement will be worse than a leak.

Re: Tesla has used space characters in internal emails to identify leaks

#343
post #325

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Data exfiltration is an extremely dangerous risk in the world of corporate espionage, especially for a company like Tesla that is trying to be first to market with something as massive as FSD. There is no way I would send anything to an external print shop from company equipment; they are almost certainly on top of that as well.

This has gotten me genuinely curious, I wonder what the safest way to get a document like that onto your own device is. Printing it on a work printer doesn't seem ideal, but I don't really know what the best approach is. Maybe emailing it to an outside address or sharing it as a document via Dropbox or similar? Copying to physical storage? All of those seem fairly easy to monitor as well though. If any infosec expert…

Anything done on a corporate machine needs to be assumed monitored. The paranoid approach would be to fully power off the machine, take the hard drive out, then use an independent machine to mount and read the data off that. Now, if they suspect that approach, or they suspect you personally, there will likely be evidence of your hardware tampering. But it would thwart automated mass-surveillance solutions.

Re: Tesla has used space characters in internal emails to identify leaks

#344
post #325

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Data exfiltration is an extremely dangerous risk in the world of corporate espionage, especially for a company like Tesla that is trying to be first to market with something as massive as FSD. There is no way I would send anything to an external print shop from company equipment; they are almost certainly on top of that as well.

This has gotten me genuinely curious, I wonder what the safest way to get a document like that onto your own device is. Printing it on a work printer doesn't seem ideal, but I don't really know what the best approach is. Maybe emailing it to an outside address or sharing it as a document via Dropbox or similar? Copying to physical storage? All of those seem fairly easy to monitor as well though. If any infosec expert…

Take photo of screen with phone camera, carry it home, OCR. If you're really paranoid you don't want to send the document's bytes off your system or use any unusual program (e.g. steganography) to edit them.

Re: Tesla has used space characters in internal emails to identify leaks

#345

~10 years ago I discovered Google doing steganography and their e-mails by accident. I was searching gmail for an e-mail message using a word I knew was definitely in the message but it was not being found. Eventually I found the e-mail and confirmed the word was definitely there. Ctrl+F and type the word, it's not found. Turned out there were random Cyrillic characters mixed through the message. Confirmed with other…

What's the context of this? Were/are you a Googler and this was in internal emails? Or was this just emails Google sends to customers? (I'm choosing to assume that this isn't about random emails other people send to Gmail addresses, that Google just messes with this way.)

Yea, this was for internal communication, presumably to catch leaks. I've not worked there for 10 years now so I can't speak to whether they're still doing anything like this internally but I wouldn't be surprised.

Re: Tesla has used space characters in internal emails to identify leaks

#346
post #245

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yep. The story as Musk tells it, and as goes viral every couple of months, is a lie.

Where has Musk told the story?

https://twitter.com/pnikosis/status/1592823543498436611. Apparently that quote is from a (now deleted) tweet of his per https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/news/international/worl....

Re: Tesla has used space characters in internal emails to identify leaks

#348
post #322
post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I love this story about Agloe, New York - a "copyright trap" that materialised into a real place: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Agloe,_New_York When another map maker put the actual settlement on their maps, the original publishers cried foul, but then discovered Agloe had become real!

Agloe anagram of legal

Uhh...

Re: Tesla has used space characters in internal emails to identify leaks

#349

Years ago, I worked at a place that attempted this. They were so giddy about it. There wasn’t even a known leak, or, arguably, anything particularly worth leaking. They were just tickled by the idea that they could gotcha anyone who tried to leak something. Then, as now, it strikes me as little more than sad and paranoid Tom Clancy cosplay. I’d like to say I’ve moved on to a place with a culture of trust and faithful…

Indeed. For example, Musk fancies himself a champion of "hard work" but what he fails to realize is that humans have not actually merged with robots yet, and we still have human needs. If innovation and brilliant thinking are part of your brand, you actually get higher quality work, sustained over a longer period of time, if you actually back off on the whip-cracking and just give people what they need to produce gre…

Maybe he realizes that, and is just a jackass.

Re: Tesla has used space characters in internal emails to identify leaks

#350
post #301

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quoted post unavailable.

I never said to leave him alone or that he's a hero or that he's the only one driving humanity forward or that he's perfect. Sometimes he's an asshole. Sometimes he's an idiot. He's flawed like every human. Your childish cult-like "spaceman bad" programming and angry projection of your daddy issues says more about you than anyone.

Hey you think I'm a brainwashed cult member, and I think you're one, also with the projection issue. So... is this a Mexican stand-off?
Post reply on HN