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Companies ran an experiment: Pay workers their full salary to work fewer days

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Re: Companies ran an experiment: Pay workers their full salary to work fewer days

#11

why would a company agree to pay the same salary for fewer hours of custody? it reminds me of the macchiavelli quote: > “How we live is so different from how we ought to live that he who studies what ought to be done rather than what is done will learn the way to his downfall rather than to his preservation.” productivity study is interesting but that's not how the real world incentives are aligned.

Because the workers produce as much (or more) in that arrangement.

Re: Companies ran an experiment: Pay workers their full salary to work fewer days

#12

why would a company agree to pay the same salary for fewer hours of custody? it reminds me of the macchiavelli quote: > “How we live is so different from how we ought to live that he who studies what ought to be done rather than what is done will learn the way to his downfall rather than to his preservation.” productivity study is interesting but that's not how the real world incentives are aligned.

Most companies in my country pays developers by days and not hours and this contract situation means that by law you have no fixed schedule and can do the hours you want as long as you deliver.

Of course, it means that you are actually working more hours than what hourly workers do but on the flip side no one can tell you anything if you disconnect for an hour in the middle.

Re: Companies ran an experiment: Pay workers their full salary to work fewer days

#13
post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, but Fire fighting for 4 days > Fire fighting for 5 days.

Also stress free for 4 days > stress free for 5 days.

Yeah, if you have 32 hours of fire fighting every week then you either love fighting fires or you need to find something that you do love.

Re: Companies ran an experiment: Pay workers their full salary to work fewer days

#14

This won't be valid for everyone, but I'm getting more and more convinced that most (a lot of?) people don't "work" work 40 hours anyway. I'm not even mentally capable of doing 40 intense hours of focussed work. Not saying I don't have other tasks besides coding/thinking in that time, but honestly not for the full slot of time. It just feels to me like some sort of secret we all share and pretend like it's fine, but…

Most remote jobs I've worked at, I can't reach anyone on Friday. Probably not a coincidence.

Even years ago when I was in the office, everyone would go on insanely long lunch breaks on Friday instead. If you work an office job, I can assure you that the number of people actually working on Friday is statistically irrelevant.

Re: Companies ran an experiment: Pay workers their full salary to work fewer days

#15

why would a company agree to pay the same salary for fewer hours of custody? it reminds me of the macchiavelli quote: > “How we live is so different from how we ought to live that he who studies what ought to be done rather than what is done will learn the way to his downfall rather than to his preservation.” productivity study is interesting but that's not how the real world incentives are aligned.

No post body was provided.

Re: Companies ran an experiment: Pay workers their full salary to work fewer days

#16

why would a company agree to pay the same salary for fewer hours of custody? it reminds me of the macchiavelli quote: > “How we live is so different from how we ought to live that he who studies what ought to be done rather than what is done will learn the way to his downfall rather than to his preservation.” productivity study is interesting but that's not how the real world incentives are aligned.

Why do companies pay for people to work "only" five days each week? Or "only" 40 hours? Why not seven days, and 84 hours each week? Surely there are people willing to work those hours for even less than companies are paying now, eliminating the deadweight loss.

Once you have the answer to that question, the answer to your question seems very straightforward.

Re: Companies ran an experiment: Pay workers their full salary to work fewer days

#17

This won't be valid for everyone, but I'm getting more and more convinced that most (a lot of?) people don't "work" work 40 hours anyway. I'm not even mentally capable of doing 40 intense hours of focussed work. Not saying I don't have other tasks besides coding/thinking in that time, but honestly not for the full slot of time. It just feels to me like some sort of secret we all share and pretend like it's fine, but…

You're probably not wrong. The data supports it.

> In October, the average workweek for all employees on private nonfarm payrolls was 34.5 hours for the fifth month in a row.

https://www.bls.gov/news.release/empsit.nr0.htm

https://www.bls.gov/news.release/empsit.t18.htm

Re: Companies ran an experiment: Pay workers their full salary to work fewer days

#18

This won't be valid for everyone, but I'm getting more and more convinced that most (a lot of?) people don't "work" work 40 hours anyway. I'm not even mentally capable of doing 40 intense hours of focussed work. Not saying I don't have other tasks besides coding/thinking in that time, but honestly not for the full slot of time. It just feels to me like some sort of secret we all share and pretend like it's fine, but…

If we "actually work" 32 hours out of 40 (80%), what is the likelihood that if we shift to a 32 hour max week, that the average person will only "actually work" ~26 hours (80% of 32) in this hypothetical future?

What if at least part of the 20% is spent doing social activities, water cooler conversations, etc. that enable the remaining 80% to flow more efficiently?

Re: Companies ran an experiment: Pay workers their full salary to work fewer days

#19
Over 200 companies have now made the switch to a 32hr work week: https://4dayweek.io/companies

The benefits for the employee are pretty obvious, but there are also many benefits for the company:

- Staff are more productive (for previous pilots: output almost always hits 100%)

- Job listings get (way) more applications

- Staff are happier

- Staff are healthier i.e. off sick less

- It's better for the environment

- Staff turnover reduces

- It attracts experienced candidates

- Costs reduce

- It's better for gender equality

Most of these companies on the site offer 100% salary, some offer 80% (but I hope to remove these in the future)

Re: Companies ran an experiment: Pay workers their full salary to work fewer days

#20

This won't be valid for everyone, but I'm getting more and more convinced that most (a lot of?) people don't "work" work 40 hours anyway. I'm not even mentally capable of doing 40 intense hours of focussed work. Not saying I don't have other tasks besides coding/thinking in that time, but honestly not for the full slot of time. It just feels to me like some sort of secret we all share and pretend like it's fine, but…

I agree we don't put in a full 40 hours. Unless someone is working a 1950's style assembly line (meatpacking plant for example) few will put in those 40 hours even in manual labor ---you're chatting, playing around, etc. for some time.

White collar work, is of course, way worse. There is a lot of slack time in between tasks and meetings and so on.

So during those 40 hours, let's say a person delivers 100 work units. If we were to say, from now on you only have to work 32 hours, some people will still deliver 100 work units, but many will deliver an approximation to 80 work units. Many people will automatically adjust. People have a "pace of work" that is like breathing.

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