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A gut-derived hormone suppresses sugar appetite/regulates food choice Drosophila

nature.com

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Re: A gut-derived hormone suppresses sugar appetite/regulates food choice Drosophila

#121

Post by drowsspa »

adrian_b wrote: post #39
dabbledash wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Appetite differences are almost certainly the primary factor in why some people get heavy and others don't, but that isn't inconsistent with CICO at all.

In my opinion, the differences in appetite are caused mostly by the differences in the type of food eaten, and not by the differences between humans. In my search for a diet that would allow me to avoid gaining weight, the main successes were achieved by replacing various kinds of food that were tasty, but which did not satiate me before eating huge amounts of them, with other kinds of food that are also tasty, but w…

But that right there is a difference between you and other humans. The idea of "searching for a diet that allows you to gain weight" is absolutely alien to me. I can easily get to 5000 calories a day without even thinking about it, while you have to make a conscious effort to reach (I assume) much less than that.

My sister and I grew up with the same diet. We didn't starve, but neither of us had lots of access to junk food. Yet she could be hungry once she got home and after half a plate to be already satiated.

Today she has tons of junk food in her house yet she doesn't feel the compulsion to eat more than a few bytes. I'm down to 71 kg from 83 kg back in June, but I still can't have a single cookie package in my house.

Re: A gut-derived hormone suppresses sugar appetite/regulates food choice Drosophila

#122

Post by djmips »

maxk42 wrote: post #60
omgwtf1000 wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I so want to do this, but I have such a sweet tooth I don’t think I can succeed. I can go a few days without sweets but then the urge is just overwhelming. I want to try weaning, by just eating fruit instead of processed treats. Will that have any effect at all, make it harder overall, or is the only way to just cut sugar completely?

Merely tasting sweetness causes an anticipatory rise in insulin which shuts down fat metabolism. Best to go cold turkey, unfortunately. You can control cravings, however, by raising your fat intake to the point where you're too full to find eating more appetizing. You will still lose weight like this on a ketogenic diet.

It makes you wonder if artificial sweeteners can also do this. Has that been studied?

Re: A gut-derived hormone suppresses sugar appetite/regulates food choice Drosophila

#123

Post by drowsspa »

jjtheblunt wrote: post #102
drowsspa wrote: post #9

I've been hitting the gym for a few months now, and one thing that completely blew my mind was the existence of hypercalorics. Imagine that, not being able to eat a lot (specially carbs) and having to resort to these solutions. Point being, people like to spew out CICO as if fat people just don't understand thermodynamics. What I've found is that matters is appetite: some people just get full way faster than others.…

NEAT?

Non-exercise activity thermogenesis: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/12468415/

Re: A gut-derived hormone suppresses sugar appetite/regulates food choice Drosophila

#124

Post by drowsspa »

0x737368 wrote: post #101
drowsspa wrote: post #9

I've been hitting the gym for a few months now, and one thing that completely blew my mind was the existence of hypercalorics. Imagine that, not being able to eat a lot (specially carbs) and having to resort to these solutions. Point being, people like to spew out CICO as if fat people just don't understand thermodynamics. What I've found is that matters is appetite: some people just get full way faster than others.…

Has nothing to do with fat people not understanding thermodynamics and has everything to do with not being able to follow the simple principle and looking for shortcuts instead.

A diet that doesn't take into account the factors that lead someone to overeat is useless by definition. If "most people can't follow this simple principle" then evidently it's a useless principle. Unless the goal is to point fingers to feel better about yourself, in which case it's pretty useful.

Re: A gut-derived hormone suppresses sugar appetite/regulates food choice Drosophila

#125

Post by socialismisok »

count wrote: post #115
dataflow wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> everything has sugar in it, and you have to absolutely avoid it, not just sweets, fruits, juices, I'd even tell you diet drinks and artificial sweeteners too. That means no ketchup, sauces, breads, and most processed and store bought foods. Realistically how do you avoid sugar like this? Soft drinks, candy, and other artificial stuff are easy enough to avoid, but most bread? Fruits? What are you supposed to eat and…

An easy way to get most of the way there: - Minimal to no fruit (that includes tomato). - Don't eat anything that comes in a package or that has an ingredients list more than 1 item long (so, frozen broccoli is fine, as long as there's no extra stuff in the bag). - Don't eat anything that your great grandparents wouldn't have had access to. Some things, like bell peppers, will start tasting like candy after a few wee…

But bell peppers have sugar, they are berries. I've done keto and had success holding sugar under, say, 10 to 12 grams. But getting to absolute zero and eating plenty of fibrous veggies is tricky.

Re: A gut-derived hormone suppresses sugar appetite/regulates food choice Drosophila

#126

Post by socialismisok »

djmips wrote: post #122
maxk42 wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Merely tasting sweetness causes an anticipatory rise in insulin which shuts down fat metabolism. Best to go cold turkey, unfortunately. You can control cravings, however, by raising your fat intake to the point where you're too full to find eating more appetizing. You will still lose weight like this on a ketogenic diet.

It makes you wonder if artificial sweeteners can also do this. Has that been studied?

It's a bit inconclusive, I believe.

Re: A gut-derived hormone suppresses sugar appetite/regulates food choice Drosophila

#127

Post by socialismisok »

huntertwo wrote: post #28
socialismisok wrote: post #2

I'd love to have some help with this. I was able to drop meat, most dairy, and salty junk food without problem. I eat plenty of green leafy vegetables. But sugar. Fuuuck I cannot walk past sweets. Sugar has claws in me I cannot shake. I hope we someday understand that mechanism better, maybe enough to give me a little help.

Maybe eat dairy and meat instead? These foods are less harmful to you and less likely to leave you hungry than sugar and processed foods.

Meat is tricky. I won't support industrial meat production, that's a hard line for me. Finding local farmers to supply meat takes time. But yes, that's an approach I could take.

Re: A gut-derived hormone suppresses sugar appetite/regulates food choice Drosophila

#128

Post by drowsspa »

garbanz0 wrote: post #52
ethanbond wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s not inconsistent (obviously, because thermodynamics), but it does make CICO a pretty useless contribution to the conversation. Not the silver bullet that proponents position it as. Successful dieting is about managing the sensation of hunger. That’s it.

I've noticed a lot of overweight people using food as a crutch to manage emotional discomfort or distress, even when they might not be all that hungry. So there is something else going on.

I'm down to 71 kg from 83 kg in June, and yeah, that was a major factor to my overeating.

Yet, some people have a different appetite, or a different reward system wiring for food, and they just don't feel the same impulse to do it even when they're stressed out.

Re: A gut-derived hormone suppresses sugar appetite/regulates food choice Drosophila

#129

Post by socialismisok »

ddorian43 wrote: post #81
socialismisok wrote: post #2

I'd love to have some help with this. I was able to drop meat, most dairy, and salty junk food without problem. I eat plenty of green leafy vegetables. But sugar. Fuuuck I cannot walk past sweets. Sugar has claws in me I cannot shake. I hope we someday understand that mechanism better, maybe enough to give me a little help.

> I was able to drop meat, most dairy, and salty junk food without problem. You are doing this completely in reverse. You need to drop sugar & carbs. And eat fatty-meat/low-carb.

No. I will not eat industrially produced meat. I dropped that a long time ago. Meat from local farmers with ethical practices is a sometimes food.

Dairy is sugar... I'll have some cottage cheese or other cheeses. And salty junk food (chips, cheese crackers, etc) is almost always high carb.

Re: A gut-derived hormone suppresses sugar appetite/regulates food choice Drosophila

#130

Post by socialismisok »

hanniabu wrote: post #65
socialismisok wrote: post #2

I'd love to have some help with this. I was able to drop meat, most dairy, and salty junk food without problem. I eat plenty of green leafy vegetables. But sugar. Fuuuck I cannot walk past sweets. Sugar has claws in me I cannot shake. I hope we someday understand that mechanism better, maybe enough to give me a little help.

> But sugar. Fuuuck I cannot walk past sweets. Sugar has claws in me I cannot shake. Do you know how many calories you're getting from the healthy food? It's actually tough to maintain 2k calories while eating very healthy so your body will get cravings for candy which it knows is calorie dense.

So, when I switched to keto and tracked everything I ate, you are absolutely correct. It's hard to eat enough calories some days.

But when I'm not totally focused on eating clean, I will eat as much sugar as I can reach.

Keto helps, but it's anything but automatic. (Especially around the holidays.)

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