Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

FTX faces potential hack, sees mysterious outflows totaling more than $600M

coindesk.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

851–860 of 890 posts

Re: FTX faces potential hack, sees mysterious outflows totaling more than $600M

#851

Post by Thorrez »

imgabe wrote: post #372
Thorrez wrote: post #259

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And if you can't find the person to sue because the person is an anoymous hacker? With fiat the court will tell the banks to reverse the transactions.

That isn’t the case here. Anyway, people get defrauded through banks all the time with advance fee fraud, 419, and other scams and banks don’t reverse those.

>That isn’t the case here.

What do you mean? Are you saying FTX wasn't hacked by an anonymous hacker?

Banks reverse transactions sometimes. It sounds like in many cases the reason they can't be reversed is because the money got converted into cryptocurrency.

>Wire Fraud Recovery is Difficult, but Possible[1]

>When the stolen funds arrive in the fraudster’s bank account, they engage a network of money launderers who immediately withdraw funds in cash, wire the money to a number of different accounts and/or convert it to cryptocurrency.[1]

>A full recovery of lost funds was only possible in 29% of cases. In 40% of the cases, less than 10% of the funds were recovered.[2]

That means that 60% of the time at least 10% of the money is recovered.

>Cyber perpetrators are moving stolen funds between bank accounts and cryptocurrency wallets at a rapid rate.[2]

[1] https://www.certifid.com/article/how-to-recover-from-wire-fr...

[2] https://blog.alta.org/2021/04/survey-title-professionals-tar...

Re: FTX faces potential hack, sees mysterious outflows totaling more than $600M

#852

Post by headsoup »

pclmulqdq wrote: post #819
svnt wrote: post #695

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s not a massive difference just a rug pull at a higher conceptual level (informational) because the obvious financial rug pull was done a hundred years ago and has since been regulated.

They always give you the information, too. People just don't always like to read it. Some people don't care, and others just jump on whatever bandwagon they can find. Almost everyone who has lost their shirt in financial derivatives in the past 50 years could have learned about the risks they were taking from some text in a prospectus somewhere, but chose not to.

That's exactly the same for crypto too though, all the warning signs are constantly there.

Re: FTX faces potential hack, sees mysterious outflows totaling more than $600M

#853

Post by pclmulqdq »

headsoup wrote: post #852
pclmulqdq wrote: post #819

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They always give you the information, too. People just don't always like to read it. Some people don't care, and others just jump on whatever bandwagon they can find. Almost everyone who has lost their shirt in financial derivatives in the past 50 years could have learned about the risks they were taking from some text in a prospectus somewhere, but chose not to.

That's exactly the same for crypto too though, all the warning signs are constantly there.

It's not that Wall Street gives you warning signs. They literally tell you "this is a probably a bad bet, and you should not take it" in the descriptions of most products. Very few people actually read those descriptions, despite the fact that they really should if they are buying weird financial products. The banks tell you to read them. And yes, a mortgage is a weird financial product.

For example, people who lost a lot of money holding XIV (a leveraged inverse-VIX ETN) had the warning about not holding the thing overnight in bold red text in the prospectus. People holding leveraged CDOs and every kind of CDS had all kinds of warnings in big bold text in their prospectus. The good old "liar's loans" of the early 2000's had big bold text saying "it will be bad for you if you lie about your income."

Pretty much the only financial products that don't come with big bold text saying "you are an idiot for buying this" are single stocks and the most boring of ETFs/mutual funds (eg SPY).

Contrast that with the warning signs from crypto projects, which are a lot more oblique than big bold text in a document that they tell you to read. Wall Street screws you, but they generally do it slowly and they tell you how. Crypto projects just straight up steal your money one day out of the blue and run to Dubai.

Re: FTX faces potential hack, sees mysterious outflows totaling more than $600M

#854

Post by hfjcic7 »

hnews_account_1 wrote: post #755
FormerBandmate wrote: post #697

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wouldn’t an insider be an expert on crypto markets? They literally ran one

1) this is not the market. It’s just blockchain txns. 2) trust me when I say, no one in crypto except some very very select exchanges actually know how to make a market trading software. They think they can compete with NYSE which is large and employs such incredible talent that it still survives in a really tough industry. They’re likely closer to my grad school project, which even I can tell you, sucked absolute ba…

You're making a lot of assumptions about people you know nothing about.

You're also making an assumption emcumbants are where they are because of their current merits and not the mere fact they're standing where someone stood before them.

Re: FTX faces potential hack, sees mysterious outflows totaling more than $600M

#855

Post by fellellor »

A cousin of mine, just a week ago proudly showed me his balance on FTX. He had earned close to 1 BTC through the various crypto consulting jobs he’d done this month. This was a huge deal for him as he’d been unemployed/underemployed for many years. And now this crap takes place. I’ve been unable to reach him since leading me to suspect that he has probably lost his money. I sincerely hope that is not the case but this entire fiasco breaks my heart. I hope SBF and his accomplices suffer and rot.

Re: FTX faces potential hack, sees mysterious outflows totaling more than $600M

#857

Post by Bootvis »

Bootvis wrote: post #295
YossarianFrPrez wrote: post #279

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's an interesting level of abstraction question. On a fine-grained level, yes, BTC works algorithmically as you have pointed out, and FFT is not the exact same thing as BTC. The question the is whether either of these things work socially / for society. Whether it's accurate or not, I imagine non-experts would regard the difference between BTC and FFT as pretty negligible, perhaps akin to the difference between "so…

The creation, distribution and governance are completely different. The public may not care but in the long run we mow see it matters.

To support my point:

https://mobile.twitter.com/whale_alert/status/15916165982801...

This doesn’t happen with BTC because it wasn’t created out of thin air.

Re: FTX faces potential hack, sees mysterious outflows totaling more than $600M

#858

Post by fellellor »

bonestamp2 wrote: post #609
X6S1x6Okd1st wrote: post #541

The hacker has spent the last 11 hours slowky and incrementally converting all the various tokens they got to ETH. They've been using a variety of different defi exchange and have eaten large slippage fees, at least once over 5M lost in slippage. We're not seeing any else, e.g. laundering through another exchange, splitting into different accounts, automating the liquidation of tokens to ETH, off loading ETH into a c…

What are the chances that this is an insider and not an outsider? I ask because the timing of this "hack" is obviously a little suspicious.

Probably SBF himself. Even if he can’t use this funds directly he can use them as collateral with a more skilled group to fund his eventual escape from the authorities

Re: FTX faces potential hack, sees mysterious outflows totaling more than $600M

#859

Post by JamesianP »

pclmulqdq wrote: post #853
headsoup wrote: post #852

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's exactly the same for crypto too though, all the warning signs are constantly there.

It's not that Wall Street gives you warning signs. They literally tell you "this is a probably a bad bet, and you should not take it" in the descriptions of most products. Very few people actually read those descriptions, despite the fact that they really should if they are buying weird financial products. The banks tell you to read them. And yes, a mortgage is a weird financial product. For example, people who lost…

CDO2s backed by worthless subprime loans were put into AAA rated bonds. I'd call that an outright scam. For that matter all versions were far more risk than they claimed they were, given that they were worthless, even if there was some fine print somewhere.

Re: FTX faces potential hack, sees mysterious outflows totaling more than $600M

#860

Post by sgammon »

shorthistory wrote: post #98
moneycantbuy wrote: post #92

to what extent can my pc/phone be compromised simply by going to a website? how would i know if malicious software is downloaded/active?

My thoughts also... can this be bigger than FTX? Can iOS/Android apps be updated without 3rd party approval?

There is no evidence that a bypass occurred related to iOS or Android app review

An analysis of the app update showed it disabling user features like account transfers. That makes sense for their bankruptcy steps.

Post reply on HN