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As last module docks, China completes its space station

nytimes.com

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Re: As last module docks, China completes its space station

#311

Post by holoduke »

homeland221 wrote: post #218
bestouff wrote: post #144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, because they are only this advanced because they stole US technology. Chinese people can't be as intelligent as american.

You got this very wrong. Read up Art of War written before Jesus. Espionage is a very important chapter. Americans are rather weak academic these days. You go to any American university and see how many "Asians" there. You will find a lot of Chinese. It is common for Americans not able to speak English well or just English. It is very uncommon not to find Chinese that can read and write Chinese AND English. There are…

The problem is that Chinese mentality results in corruption, denialism and other attributes what makes working on R&D almost impossible. For that you need free minds, room for mistakes, no strong hiarchy. All things you won't find in China.

Re: As last module docks, China completes its space station

#312

Post by aasasd »

throwaway4good wrote: post #270
diskzero wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thanks for the super informative reply. I am hoping as there is more activity on the space station, that more information will be coming out. It would be nice to be able to see something similar to the ESA, NASA and even Roscosmos launch feeds and Q&A sessions.

Plenty coverage exists in Chinese from children shows to academia, and you can also show up on Hainan island to watch a launch. However it doesn’t get much coverage in western media beyond a Cold War / environmental risk angle.

There's this clip showing some experiments for the benefit of schoolchildren: https://reddit.com/comments/y2kjmi

I'm guessing this is an ongoing thing, and since the clip popped up on Reddit it seems at least ‘social media’ pick up on such output.

Re: As last module docks, China completes its space station

#313

Post by smileysteve »

throwaway4good wrote: post #268
russli1993 wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Some of the features I know from the Chinese space station - Solar panels smaller in area than ISS but produces similar amount of power, indicating much more efficient solar panels - Ion thrusters to keep space in orbit - Automated docking of cargo and crew capsule. Semi-automated docking of large station components like the 23ton labs - A robotic arm similar to ISS that walk along the joint points on the station. It…

Just imagine all that effort and resources being spent on the International Space Station instead. I wonder were we, the combined humanity, could have been in terms of space exploration, if we just could have been bothered to work together.

Timing wise, ISS is at end of life, and replacement plans are a decade off. So, in a way this produces needed overlap (from a humanity standpoint).

Re: As last module docks, China completes its space station

#314

Post by lambdadmitry »

ClumsyPilot wrote: post #201
ElevenLathe wrote: post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's true in a way but just pushes things back a level of causality: if we train more people as aerospace engineers, then we will have fewer trained people in other specialties. We have a finite supply of enthusiastic, smart young people to drive change. The best answer of course is "do both" and make sure more of our young people are happy, enthusiastic, and able to access necessary training and education. There are…

> We have a finite supply of enthusiastic, smart young people to drive change And currently most of them go into trading, which is a zero-sum game, or into building another social network that causes depression. Look at top-ten list of high paying jobs, and ask youself how much crucial work for society they do

Trading is not exactly zero sum. Trading is price discovery + arbitrage, both of which are useful even if imperfect.

Re: As last module docks, China completes its space station

#315

Post by philwelch »

nimbius wrote: post #202
tunesmith wrote: post #167

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"sanction" is one of the dumbest words on earth. "to give official approval" vs "impose a penalty".

So for those wondering why no US collaboration, you can blame republican octogenarian Frank Wolf for introducting the Wolf amendment prohibiting any and all NASA collaboration with china that isnt expressly sanctioned by the rest of the geriatrics in congress. he even managed to fuck up the 2013 Kepler Science Conference which resulted in a mass boycott after two chinese scientists were banned. We had every opportuni…

Good for him. Collaborating with the CCP regime is not in the best interest of the US or other Western countries, and in fact, US policy would be better served in the long run by isolating and decoupling from China even more.

Re: As last module docks, China completes its space station

#316

Post by philwelch »

ChemSpider wrote: post #301
adrian_b wrote: post #250

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It would be interesting to see some concrete examples of what is claimed in "Once parity is reached, China cuts collaboration agreements and keeps further advancements within China." Whenever I search recent research articles about any topic, I see a very large number that are published by China, and which are freely available. The quality of the Chinese research is quite uneven, there are many papers that are just g…

Just one of many examples: The WIV BSL-4 lab in Wuhan was built as a French-Chinese cooperation (modeled after a similar lab in Lyon, France) with the explicit goal to do joint experiments. But once it was built, the French were kicked out.

And the French getting kicked out is only the second worst consequence of that project! Though for what it’s worth, I think there was Western collaboration with WIV as well.

Re: As last module docks, China completes its space station

#317

Post by ElevenLathe »

ch4s3 wrote: post #211
ElevenLathe wrote: post #196

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nonetheless, if they choose to be an aerospace engineer, they've chosen not to be, for example, a surgeon, or whatever else.

Yes, that is how choice and specialization work, we don't live in a feudal or autocratic system where heredity or fiat determine your life path.

I didn't say any of that?

Re: As last module docks, China completes its space station

#318

Post by burkaman »

holoduke wrote: post #242
burkaman wrote: post #160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Does completing a space station not count as success? Also, here's a video of this launch, people look pretty happy to be honest: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4xcgT93s08o

Where do you see them happy? I saw some people holding a Chinese flag. You really believe that's genuine? Nah I don't buy that

3:52, 5:00, 5:13. Compare to 6:15 of this recent SpaceX launch: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7qAbM5Noq48. How will SpaceX ever succeed with such miserable, unmotivated staff??!?

Re: As last module docks, China completes its space station

#319

Post by ClumsyPilot »

mehrdada wrote: post #252
ClumsyPilot wrote: post #198

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ah, so the chaos and lack of documentation in my company is really protection against chinese spies! Clever! On a more serious note, I find it quite unfair that Western conoany go into China to take advantage of loose labour laws and child labour, and then they complain when loose IP laws hit them. Like you knew what the deal was from the outset. Lastly not every society believes in the concept of intellectual proper…

You just took one angle. I find it unfair that Facebook is banned by China while China can deploy TikTok in the US market, for example, to demonstrate the opposite.

Looking at how Facebook was fucking with UK elections and brexit, maybe it should be banned everywhere

Re: As last module docks, China completes its space station

#320

Post by [deleted] »

iancmceachern wrote: post #253
bee_rider wrote: post #251

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Contracts and deals are subordinate to the laws of the country in which we'd like them to be enforced. It's not like a company goes to China and expects tight IP laws. And hey, our (American) IP laws were a lot less strict when we were catching up to the British Empire. Countries generally try to set their laws up to benefit their industries (to the extent possible).

I agree with all this. Where does all the ip theft via hacking fall into this view? By this logic hat should be held accountable to the laws of this country, no? Lots of links to Wikipedia lists of examples in other threads here.

[deleted]
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