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“Twitter will be forming a content moderation council with diverse viewpoints”

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Re: “Twitter will be forming a content moderation council with diverse viewpoints”

#741
post #7

This sort of justifies the viewpoint that despite all his bluster, Elon will probably run Twitter the way a "reasonable executive" would. Not just release the hounds. Keep the advertisers happy, but try to reduce the reliance on advertisers. Keep moderating content to reduce abuse, maybe eliminate the high profile banning but a person on the ground will have largely the same experience. (probably less action on more…

So, create a court system basically that decides on free speech issues. Got it. Likely will arrive at the same conclusion as the legal system that’s been operating for over 200 years. There’s a reason the legal system said free speech is out to the point of direct imminent harm. It was the arrogance of 20 year old programmers in silicon valley who thought they could create a better legal system.

That's one big problem with these (US based) companies. They don't apply the spirit of the laws in their own home country that allowed/allows them to exist. Zuckerberg has even claimed that fb is a "digital town square".

They don't mind enforcing speech laws of other countries, lowest common denominator.

No tears would be shed if they were broken up, nationalized, etc.

Re: “Twitter will be forming a content moderation council with diverse viewpoints”

#742

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I expect he's never going to allow calls to violence or incitement type things; who exactly thinks this is a bad decision? … Is giving the republicans their voice back and allowing them to speak really such a nightmare? Well let’s see… last time the former President was using his voice on Twitter, he was inciting and directing an insurrection against the government. So if Musk wants to reverse that ban, and Trump d…

>Well let’s see… last time the former President was using his voice on Twitter, he was inciting and directing an insurrection against the government. So if Musk wants to reverse that ban, and Trump decides to continue his rhetoric which already caused violence (which he will because he hasn’t stopped since 1/6), then yeah, that’s a nightmare. I'm not american and just an outside observer. I believe the republicans/tr…

> There is certainly a huge irreconcilable divide on how January 6th is viewed on either side.

Yes, insurrectionists typically see their actions as justified, and will frame them as such. What happened was an insurrection though, and the 1/6 committee and DOJ have done much to prove that.

> Lets not forget Hillary Clinton has always held Trump stole the election

She’s free to feel however she wants. But note she didn’t go to Twitter to foment insurrection.

> she even reiterated a few days ago the republicans are planning to do it again

Probably a safe bet, given Trump hasn’t even given up trying to steal the 2020 election.

Re: “Twitter will be forming a content moderation council with diverse viewpoints”

#743

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are they known to the public is what's important

Levine was very prominent among conservative media, not due to being trans, but due to being a prominent part of Biden's Covid response alongside Fauci. It wasn't a random targeting.

And when SNL satirizes a political figure, absolutely no one refers to it as "targeting"

Re: “Twitter will be forming a content moderation council with diverse viewpoints”

#744

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But I absolutely don't want Twitter to decide which organisations are like the NAACP and which are like the Klan. This is regardless of who runs Twitter.

Well, good luck having a readable twitter then

I'd rather read what people really think than what they are allowed to think.

Re: “Twitter will be forming a content moderation council with diverse viewpoints”

#745
post #7

This sort of justifies the viewpoint that despite all his bluster, Elon will probably run Twitter the way a "reasonable executive" would. Not just release the hounds. Keep the advertisers happy, but try to reduce the reliance on advertisers. Keep moderating content to reduce abuse, maybe eliminate the high profile banning but a person on the ground will have largely the same experience. (probably less action on more…

> This sort of justifies the viewpoint that despite all his bluster, Elon will probably run Twitter the way a "reasonable executive" would. Not just release the hounds.

He literally just had every engineer print out the last 3 months of code lol

Re: “Twitter will be forming a content moderation council with diverse viewpoints”

#746
The hatred exhibited in all these Twitter-related threads, both here and elsewhere is truly something to behold.

In a free society everyone should be for the protection of free speech. Note that this does not mean unmitigated slinging of fecal matter. It does, however, mean that platforms with significant reach should not be engaged in explicitly favoring one side or another. They need to enabled open and "color blind" discussion. And, yes, while moderation is necessary even in places like HN, it cannot, should not, be ideological. That's how you end-up with China, North Korea, Iran, etc.

Cue arguments about the first amendment only being applicable to government. That isn't what this is about. At all.

Imagine an extreme case where all social media outlets, news stations, newspapers and even universities are controlled by, say, the Chinese Communist Party or some other extreme. Yes, a crazy out-there hypothetical. Sometimes exaggeration is able to lend clarity that is hard to convey in other ways.

Well, that's the kind of thing we have had for years now. Don't believe me? Kindly present a list of right wing, left wing and independents who have been banned from places like Twitter and Facebook. One side of that list will be almost empty. And that, precisely, is the problem Elon wants to solve. He isn't interested in tilting it in the opposite direction. He wants that list, when it comes to Twitter, to be equitable and, more than likely, as small as absolutely necessary.

What is wrong with that? Why the hatred?

Re: “Twitter will be forming a content moderation council with diverse viewpoints”

#747
post #618

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sentiment analysis can solve the first. If the algo notices that someone only engages negatively with another cluster, cut it off; they're not entitled to pollute that. And the second point was a mostly abstract intellectual debate in the early 2010s, but people have proven that they absolutely prefer to stick with their own, and have close-to-zero tolerance for dissent or disagreement (see, "the hivemind"). Twitter…

I think polarization is likely to be much more extreme if you silo people off into like minded groups.

People will get bored, eventually, slumbering in a Pablum of like-mindedness.

Re: “Twitter will be forming a content moderation council with diverse viewpoints”

#748

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Babylon Bee being suspended was one of the dumber things the previous Twitter rules had done. It's a satire site, it's right leaning, nothing in the piece they said was hateful or even an unpopular view. Kanye's ban, he's just a mentally ill person. I don't think he meant "death con" he just didn't know that it's actually "def con." His remarks are still reprehensible. Twitter's whole moderation problem has been it i…

> Babylon Bee being suspended was one of the dumber things the previous Twitter rules had done. It's a satire site, it's right leaning, nothing in the piece they said was hateful or even an unpopular view. They didn’t even make a joke. They just called trans woman a man. It was hate speech, pure and simple. I am very afraid for the future of twitter now. Hate speech is going to run rampant on that platform now.

Stop desperately trying to change to definition of hate speech.

Re: “Twitter will be forming a content moderation council with diverse viewpoints”

#750
post #633

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem is that reddit clusters based on topic, rather than social group. If I'm a bad state actor who wants to influence America on a mass-scale, I buy a bunch of accounts, and buy upvotes, and can shift the hivemind. Or I just infiltrate the mod team. Obviously you'd need to be relatively sophisticated to not get caught. But Twitter is based on social circles, not topics; those concerns don't apply. Instead of…

TBH I don't think clustering on social groups is the panacea that you hope. Misinformation spreads insanely fast on WhatsApp, even after limiting Group thread size and # of forwards. We'll never get back to the way things were before the internet became ubiquitous. Back then, we had a limited number of sources, and normal people had very limited reach. But now, it's too easy for individuals to pass information along,…

May not be a panacea, but it's the healthiest option.

> Misinformation spreads insanely fast on WhatsApp, even after limiting Group thread size and # of forwards.

That's true, but it's relatively easier to solve: really viral messages are a minuscule minority, and can set off internal alerts and be reviewed by humans; to prevent hysteria and murderous rhetoric.

And the problem also existed with word-of-mouth, centuries ago, before the masses ever startied reading "the press"; rumors could spread across entire nations. Fake stuff will spread, and people will become more skeptical and adapt, as they did before. Skin in the Game makes a related point.¹

The whole problem with censoring "disinformation" is that it removes society's self-healing mechanisms. Public discourse has always been messy. Louis Farrakhan is labelled hateful, but he ran the Million Man March and is credited getting many African-American men to register to vote. Malcolm X would have been considered an extremist and banned. But it would have been wrong; he may have been flawed on the micro level (that's subjective), but he was beneficial and heroic on the macro level. Censorship has huge second order effects, including self-censorship, introducing status-quo bias. It also promotes conspiratorial thinking, since people who think information is being hidden from them are more likely to seek fringe sources.

How do you censor real disinformation, without ending up with things like the Hunter Biden story being censored too? It also allows governments to lie with impunity, because accusations that the government is lying are treated as disinformation, while actual government lies (like the intel agency staffers who said the Hunter laptop was a Russian psyop) are spread everywhere.² People need to be able to spread "conspiracies", since while they may be factually incorrect, they may be directionally correct, while the "official" narrative may be total BS. Note I couldn't care less about Hunter or his laptop, but it's a clear recent example.

¹ https://medium.com/incerto/the-facts-are-true-the-news-is-fa...

² https://greenwald.substack.com/p/biden-the-media-and-cia-lab...

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