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AI will replace middle management before robots replace hourly workers

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Re: AI will replace middle management before robots replace hourly workers

#371

Post by snowwrestler »

jjk166 wrote: post #369
snowwrestler wrote: post #364

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apologies if I missed it, but where in your story did a human get replaced? There were still people working inventory, cash registers, and managing. I say this because it seems pretty obvious that software can improve the productivity of employees (including managers). But what the blog post at the top says is that AI will replace managers as a category of employees—a much stronger claim.

Machines don't do jobs, machines do tasks. It's very rare for a company to fire people because there is now a system that does exactly what they did before, no more no less. But when you take all the core tasks that a person did as part of their job and automate them away, such that the employee now is doing something completely different, they have been replaced even though they're still on the pay roll. It's functi…

> when you take all the core tasks that a person did as part of their job and automate them away

But that is not what happened in the story I responded to. The manager still had tasks exclusive to them (dealing with young employees and angry customers) that had not been automated away.

Re: AI will replace middle management before robots replace hourly workers

#372

Post by jjk166 »

snowwrestler wrote: post #371
jjk166 wrote: post #369

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Machines don't do jobs, machines do tasks. It's very rare for a company to fire people because there is now a system that does exactly what they did before, no more no less. But when you take all the core tasks that a person did as part of their job and automate them away, such that the employee now is doing something completely different, they have been replaced even though they're still on the pay roll. It's functi…

> when you take all the core tasks that a person did as part of their job and automate them away But that is not what happened in the story I responded to. The manager still had tasks exclusive to them (dealing with young employees and angry customers) that had not been automated away.

Tasks exclusive to them, but not the tasks of a manager. A manager manages. As OP stated, the position with the title of "manager" now has the tasks of a babysitter.

Re: AI will replace middle management before robots replace hourly workers

#373

Post by marcosdumay »

SergeAx wrote: post #359
marcosdumay wrote: post #358

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are those trips not paid?

Of course they are paid, what's your point?

The driver is seeing extra revenue from an activity that is inherently limited (how long he will drive back on the direction of home).

As a rule, isn't that beneficial for drivers? Why are you talking like if it is inherently bad? Is there something that doesn't fit my description?

Re: AI will replace middle management before robots replace hourly workers

#374

Post by kcexn »

quirkot wrote: post #21

I think this article fundamentally misunderstands the core function of middle management. You can boil it down to 2 key tasks (on the front lines of a very large organization). a) Interpreting: either top->down by explaining and enforcing corporate policy on hourly workers or bottom->up by ensuring workers enter data to be reported on correctly b) "Encouraging": an employee calls in sick, again. Neither firing them o…

'Middle Management' is also not a well defined term.

For some, managers like you have described could be thought of as front line managers. Or supervisors.

And middle management are the layers, usually many, that separate the front line managers from the senior executives.

The role of middle management is often to oversee budgets, and be accountable for financial performance in certain geographic regions or business areas.

Middle managers don't employ workers. They employ other managers. Lots of these kinds of jobs will probably be made so simple that entire layers of management will just be removed.

Some examples from chain retail might be:

The franchisee of say, a McDonald's, is in some sense a middle manager. They hire store managers to run the stores in the area that they're responsible for. And they're accountable for the financial performance of all the McDonald's that they own.

The 'Regional Manager' of some large company. They won't be involved in the day to day activity of the business, but they're often an important cog in the wheel because they have local visibility on the financial performance of the business in the region, and are best positioned to allocate the budget in ways that maximize financial performance. Again, they don't hire workers, they hire other managers.

Re: AI will replace middle management before robots replace hourly workers

#375

Post by SergeAx »

marcosdumay wrote: post #373
SergeAx wrote: post #359

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Of course they are paid, what's your point?

The driver is seeing extra revenue from an activity that is inherently limited (how long he will drive back on the direction of home). As a rule, isn't that beneficial for drivers? Why are you talking like if it is inherently bad? Is there something that doesn't fit my description?

Ride towards home is good for driver. Another ride in the opposite direction, which is set via data analysis and previous driver behavior - inherently evil.

Re: AI will replace middle management before robots replace hourly workers

#377

Post by ciceryadam »

DonHopkins wrote: post #80
wefarrell wrote: post #45

This reminds me of an argument I got into at a bar with someone who claimed robots would inevitably replace bartenders. I took the view that bartenders would be the last occupation to be replaced by robots because if the goal was to minimize the cost to consume alcohol people wouldn't be coming to bars in the first place. There's a misconception that jobs with higher pay and more prestige will be the last to be repla…

And as robots replaced more jobs, more people would be going to bars.

Higher unemployment wouldn't necessarily mean fuller bars. Probably more at home drinking.

Re: AI will replace middle management before robots replace hourly workers

#378

Post by scrubs »

LeonM wrote: post #219

I worked for a large grocery store chain between 2004 and 2010, there the AI had already taken over. Though we didn't call it an AI, just 'the system'. The system was able to procure goods with stunning accuracy. Sometimes it even surprised us. For example: we'd receive a much higher number of BBQ meat than typical, only to realise it was going to be amazing weather the coming days. The system was also making schedul…

Ordering stuff not middle management. I seriously doubt an AI claiming MM know how could produce a 3-10 page telling me what it is. And unless AI replaced all the staff, I'd wanna be in the room to see NFW looks from people getting management direction, reviews, budgets standing on articulated customer priorities,and cross functional coordination from AI

Re: AI will replace middle management before robots replace hourly workers

#379

Post by xcambar »

BlargMcLarg wrote: post #188
AussieWog93 wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People love to shit on middle managers, but I can say all the ones I worked under (as a SWE, at the one company) were all smarter and more experienced than I was, and I really appreciated the mentorship.

Great. Mine asked their employees how they could help with tasks they knew 0 about, try to solve technical and political issues by playing team therapist, and couldn't even read the Scrum guide deep enough to know what is and isn't part of it. Anecdotes are great, aren't they?

Anecdotes are crucial for they are the bed of experience.

Don't belittle someone like you did, you just make yourself the fool.

I'm sorry you've met poor middle managers bit really you didn't get your point across. Like, at all.

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