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India fines Google $162M for anti-competitive practices on Android

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Re: India fines Google $162M for anti-competitive practices on Android

#161

Post by whimsicalism »

eastern wrote: post #128
tatpacc wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

other comment mentioning that "Ambani’s Reliance co will launch search next month." is not realistic. I mean even Bing is not able to capture significant market share of Google after all these years. > Google forbidding Indian telcom companies and Chinese smartphone manufactures from installing adwarecrap has made the ultra-cheap smartphone experience somewhat tolerable for hundreds of millions of people. however, th…

So basically you're saying that here's an American company that is monopolising a critical market in my country, but I prefer that monopoly to continue because I have built up this scenario in which an Indian company might monopolise it instead. Interesting.

One is a monopoly because they outcompeted their competitors, the other is a monopoly due to state force.

Re: India fines Google $162M for anti-competitive practices on Android

#162

Post by vkou »

makeitdouble wrote: post #101
vkou wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wouldn't describe Nokia, Blackberry, or Palm as 'better options' in that space.

I'm not sure what you are pointing at, what are Nokia, Blackberry, or Palm alternatives of ? They all peaked at different areas and I feel little overlap.

Your post had a few implications.

1. There were phones better than Windows Phone.

2. Microsoft failed to bully its way into dominance with a worse product.

3. Google and Apple, on the other hand, did.

What were the better products than Windows Phone? Certainly it wasn't Palm, Nokia, or Blackberry. You don't seem to think so, either.

Was it Android and IOS? Does this mean you think they are the better/best products? If so, why do you also assert #3?

Re: India fines Google $162M for anti-competitive practices on Android

#163

Post by eastern »

MisterSandman wrote: post #158
eastern wrote: post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So basically you're saying that here's an American company that is monopolising a critical market in my country, but I prefer that monopoly to continue because I have built up this scenario in which an Indian company might monopolise it instead. Interesting.

I mean, yes, quite literally, because Google's "monopolisation" pales in comparison to the insane influence Jio already has. Jio was the first telecom in India that required it's users to submit fingerprints to get a SIM card. You can't get more explicitly dystopian than that - want internet? Submit your fingerprints so we can link it to your National Identity Document and who you call/text.

This is a complete fabrication. Aadhaar verification via biometrics was permitted for all financial, telecom and other services simultaneously. I got fingerprinted for an Airtel SIM and a Kotak Bank account first and Jio much later.

Re: India fines Google $162M for anti-competitive practices on Android

#164

Post by tatpacc »

eastern wrote: post #163
MisterSandman wrote: post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean, yes, quite literally, because Google's "monopolisation" pales in comparison to the insane influence Jio already has. Jio was the first telecom in India that required it's users to submit fingerprints to get a SIM card. You can't get more explicitly dystopian than that - want internet? Submit your fingerprints so we can link it to your National Identity Document and who you call/text.

This is a complete fabrication. Aadhaar verification via biometrics was permitted for all financial, telecom and other services simultaneously. I got fingerprinted for an Airtel SIM and a Kotak Bank account first and Jio much later.

> This is a complete fabrication.

it isn't fabrication, when fingerprint authentication was (may be still) the ONLY option provided by Jio. I went to buy Jio sim and decided to not buy only because there wasn't other option like submitting copy of document which all other telecom companies provide.

Re: India fines Google $162M for anti-competitive practices on Android

#165

Post by smaudet »

scarface74 wrote: post #88
smaudet wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Where Microsoft had marketing and familiarity, Apple has/had a better touch (UX as it's often called). Unfortunately for people who entered their ecosystem, there is a heavy influence to keep them there (more than a walled garden, an active insulation and inculcation - its hard to take your life elsewhere if you bought into the Apple ecosystem). That's disappeared a bit with the cloud, but native apps still perform b…

> Unfortunately for people who entered their ecosystem, there is a heavy influence to keep them there (more than a walled garden, an active insulation and inculcation - its hard to take your life elsewhere if you bought into the Apple ecosystem). Where? Any music you bought from iTunes since 2009 was DRM free. Apple Music runs on Android, Amazon Fire devices and a few other non Apple platforms. The AppleTV app is ava…

All your examples seem to be of running Apple stuff on Android.

None of it is about actually moving off it.

The few examples you mention such as bluetooth and mp3 files from iTunes are to do with an industry standard, not because of something Apple did.

” Apple also participates in the Movies AnyWhere initiative along with most of the major studios. Meaning when you purchase a movie from Apple, Amazon, Google, Vudu etc they are added to all of your libraries.”

I am not familiar with this, which libraries where?

Regardless, this doesnt seem like a winning proposition "Use android and just use all our apps on it", why?? You switch off Apple because it has issues so you continue to use Apple?

Better off never to enter in the first place.

Re: India fines Google $162M for anti-competitive practices on Android

#167

Post by makeitdouble »

vkou wrote: post #162
makeitdouble wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not sure what you are pointing at, what are Nokia, Blackberry, or Palm alternatives of ? They all peaked at different areas and I feel little overlap.

Your post had a few implications. 1. There were phones better than Windows Phone. 2. Microsoft failed to bully its way into dominance with a worse product. 3. Google and Apple, on the other hand, did. What were the better products than Windows Phone? Certainly it wasn't Palm, Nokia, or Blackberry. You don't seem to think so, either. Was it Android and IOS? Does this mean you think they are the better/best products? I…

I see iOS and android as fundamentally better than the Windows Phone. Windows Phone was an innovative idea and a breeze of fresh air, but was way too opinionated and only shined in some specific usage patterns. That’s why I think developers had such a hard time to adapt to it. If I had to choose a dead horse, I’d choose Palm’s WebOS as a more viable idea that was very poorly executed and way too early for the market.

> Google and Apple, on the other hand, did.

Both these companies bullied competition in other aspects than the OS in itself.

Google bullied makers through the Play Store+Play services bundling, forcing them to get rid of preinstalled third party stores and keep the Google search widget on the home screen and Google as the default search engine.

Apple bullied app makers by kicking any third party store, third party web engine, blocked third party content store and mail clients from getting default status. Apple’s top position as a music service comes from the iPod, but was also clearly cemented by locking out competition as the iPhone was the top selling smartphone. People are a lot more divided on where’s Apple’s fault, but at least I don’t see it as an issue of OS bundling the same way Microsoft crossed the line on OS bundling. Times have changed in this respect.

Re: India fines Google $162M for anti-competitive practices on Android

#168

Post by scarface74 »

smaudet wrote: post #165
scarface74 wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Unfortunately for people who entered their ecosystem, there is a heavy influence to keep them there (more than a walled garden, an active insulation and inculcation - its hard to take your life elsewhere if you bought into the Apple ecosystem). Where? Any music you bought from iTunes since 2009 was DRM free. Apple Music runs on Android, Amazon Fire devices and a few other non Apple platforms. The AppleTV app is ava…

All your examples seem to be of running Apple stuff on Android. None of it is about actually moving off it. The few examples you mention such as bluetooth and mp3 files from iTunes are to do with an industry standard, not because of something Apple did. ” Apple also participates in the Movies AnyWhere initiative along with most of the major studios. Meaning when you purchase a movie from Apple, Amazon, Google, Vudu e…

> The few examples you mention such as bluetooth and mp3 files from iTunes are to do with an industry standard, not because of something Apple did.

“The industry” didn’t push for DRM free music. Apple did.

https://macdailynews.com/2007/02/06/apple_ceo_steve_jobs_pos...

“The Industry” wanted Apple to license FairPlay DRM to other sellers.

The claim was that you were locked into Apple’s ecosystem. The truth is that you can just as easily have a mix of Apple, Android Macs and Windows.

I forgot to mention that Apple has official plugins for Chrome and Firefox for Windows that let you sync bookmarks with Safari/iCloud.

> I am not familiar with this, which libraries where

https://help.moviesanywhere.com/hc/en-us/articles/1150045761...

It’s not a backdoor hack.

> Regardless, this doesnt seem like a winning proposition "Use android and just use all our apps on it", why?? You switch off Apple because it has issues so you continue to use Apple?

All what apps? You copy your files from iCloud to another storage provider. There are plenty of utilities that allow you to copy playlists over. Music you bought from iTunes is DRM free, etc.

No company that you buy TV shows from allow you to transfer them DRN free and there is nothing that Apple can do about the movie studios that won’t participate in MoviesAnywhere.

If you buy a digital book from Amazon, you have to use “their app” on other platforms. If you use Google Docs, you have to either export it or use “their apps” on other platforms. What’s the difference?

Re: India fines Google $162M for anti-competitive practices on Android

#169

Post by anshumankmr »

nmridul wrote: post #43
keewee7 wrote: post #14

Good in theory but Google's Android apps and Google forbidding Indian telcom companies and Chinese smartphone manufactures from installing adwarecrap has made the ultra-cheap smartphone experience somewhat tolerable for hundreds of millions of people. It's all going to be insufferable adware hell from now on.

Except Motorola (now owned by Lenovo and claims closest to default Android) most of the Chinese phones still come with their own bloatware. Xiaomi has many default apps including their own Messaging, file manager, dialer. These come with their own user agreement and privacy policy. Some of these apps are good to have while others are just bloat.

Samsung too has a tonne of bloatware crap. I bought a phone for 30K (which is a decent amount for a phone IMO) and it was loaded with absolute crap I don't use and can't even remove with adb.
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