Live data from Hacker News

Most people on antidepressants don’t need them

economist.com

71–80 of 167 posts

Re: Most people on antidepressants don’t need them

#71
post #32

Statements like this need to be worded very carefully. In many people's minds, saying something like "most people don't need antidepressants" quickly becomes "antidepressants are useless". Many people who may benefit from them get scared away. Speaking as someone who has been on/off antidepressants for GAD+OCD for the better part of a decade, I've had countless people tell me that antidepressants are useless and just…

Quoted post unavailable.

I believe I was quite careful in what I said rather than pimping antidepressants.

Each time I start a course of antidepressants, I am genuinely worried what the outcome will be. Messing with your brain chemistry isn't something to do lightly. But equally, for many people, possibly including myself, it quite literally saves their life.

However, I must take umbrage at your characterisation of how considering a course of these drugs is akin to taking on a lifetime addiction.

They do cause withdrawal/discontinuation effects if you stop suddenly, and often tapering isn't particularly pleasant either. This is something that users of these drugs have known for a long time, likely since they first hit the market, but it took a surprisingly long time for the medical industry to accept this and list it on patient information leaflets.

I also certainly accept that many doctors are quite terrible at discussing potential side effects and discontinuation syndrome with patients. This doesn't just concern antidepressants or even heavily marketed drugs. Common, generic, 50+ year old antibiotics can have really horrific side effects that aren't often mentioned by your doctor. This is a serious informed consent issue that needs addressing more widely within the medical field.

However, these drugs are not heroin. They are, for most people, relatively easy (albeit sometimes unpleasant) to taper. They don't cause the same kind of pleasure/punishment cycle that makes substances like cocaine or heroin so hard to quit. You don't become a fiend when you miss a dose, you just feel shitty and get some brain zaps. Nobody's holding up gas stations to get some dollars to pay for their Prozac. If you do discontinue antidepressants, your life is typically better for having taken them compared to when you started, and for the most part, you can take these drugs for your entire life without significant adverse consequences.

Re: Most people on antidepressants don’t need them

#72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Be careful what you pimp These aren't drugs you can just ask for (in the UK) at least and the parent wasn't "pimping". Undermining someone's account of their positive experience using therapeutic drugs because of your own bias shows an astounding lack of compassion.. Getting help, help that often involves therapeutic drugs to bootstrap other life changes _is_ taking responsibility. Your comment neatly sums up the t…

Breaking cycles or bootstrapping changes for those too overwhelmed with depression or anxiety to make lige changes are the ideal uses for the drugs. And then you are supposed to get weaned off them until the next spiral, and then ise rhem to shorten that one too. But in the US plenty of doctors seem to treat simply asking for these drugs as the requisite symptoms for diagnosis. Andany people I care about were diagnos…

Too many people take these drugs just so that they don't have to take responsibility for their own lives.

And that is the cause of a lot of ruin around the world - not just in the US.

Re: Most people on antidepressants don’t need them

#73
post #32

Statements like this need to be worded very carefully. In many people's minds, saying something like "most people don't need antidepressants" quickly becomes "antidepressants are useless". Many people who may benefit from them get scared away. Speaking as someone who has been on/off antidepressants for GAD+OCD for the better part of a decade, I've had countless people tell me that antidepressants are useless and just…

Quoted post unavailable.

Are diabetics "addicted" to insulin?

> Taking a pill means not taking responsibility

I think this nonsense deserves some psychoanalysis of itself, as well as acknowledging that brain chemistry does matter for various sorts of mental illness.

Re: Most people on antidepressants don’t need them

#74
I find it interesting that the article doesn’t describe a single harm from the drugs, instead focusing on alleged weak efficacy.

My theory is that the article is playing into a vaguely Protestant ethos that drugs are Bad and Unnatural and thus suspect, and (implicitly) that suffering is actually good to some extent and that alleviating it through “artificial” means is unnatural. This attitude is ubiquitous in the US and I assume UK (where Economist originates) as well. Even artificial sweeteners are ridiculously scrutinized and suspect for the same reason.

If some or even many people are taking what the article calls “useless” drugs, how is that, absent serious side effects, bad?

Re: Most people on antidepressants don’t need them

#75
post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quoted post unavailable.

I believe I was quite careful in what I said rather than pimping antidepressants. Each time I start a course of antidepressants, I am genuinely worried what the outcome will be. Messing with your brain chemistry isn't something to do lightly. But equally, for many people, possibly including myself, it quite literally saves their life. However, I must take umbrage at your characterisation of how considering a course o…

These drugs ruin lives just as efficiently as they 'improve' them.

Be very, very careful if you are going to advise people that they should overlook the evidence of this fact, "because they're great for me so you should try them too!".

Yes, you are pimping these drugs in so doing.

Re: Most people on antidepressants don’t need them

#76

Statements like this need to be worded very carefully. In many people's minds, saying something like "most people don't need antidepressants" quickly becomes "antidepressants are useless". Many people who may benefit from them get scared away. Speaking as someone who has been on/off antidepressants for GAD+OCD for the better part of a decade, I've had countless people tell me that antidepressants are useless and just…

> Statements like this need to be worded very carefully. In many people's minds, saying something like "most people don't need antidepressants" quickly becomes "antidepressants are useless".

The statement is factually true and worded correctly.

Re: Most people on antidepressants don’t need them

#77
post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your comment is execrable.

So is the conclusion that these drugs are worth the side effects, expense, and significant addiction - just because someone on the Internet had a good time on them.

These drugs do not give you a "good" time, they can at best give you a more normal one.

Re: Most people on antidepressants don’t need them

#78
post #73
post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quoted post unavailable.

Are diabetics "addicted" to insulin? > Taking a pill means not taking responsibility I think this nonsense deserves some psychoanalysis of itself, as well as acknowledging that brain chemistry does matter for various sorts of mental illness.

Insulin is not the same as prozac, yo.

One is designed to get you high so you can deal with your life in a "socially acceptable manner" - the other one helps blood sugar enter the body's cells so it can be used for energy. One is a social crutch - the other, vital medicine.

Re: Most people on antidepressants don’t need them

#79

Statements like this need to be worded very carefully. In many people's minds, saying something like "most people don't need antidepressants" quickly becomes "antidepressants are useless". Many people who may benefit from them get scared away. Speaking as someone who has been on/off antidepressants for GAD+OCD for the better part of a decade, I've had countless people tell me that antidepressants are useless and just…

For what we've been reading this last years, it's not like antidepressants are worthless, it's like antidepressants aren't doing what we think are doing. The "depression is lack of serotonin" theories seem to have less and less base every day, but SSRIs don't only act on serotonin (just review their side effects). I've done, mostly, vortioxetine and sertraline. For some of us, some SSRIs or SNRIs work. Some don't. Pr…

> The "depression is lack of serotonin" theories seem to have less and less base every day

But that is not true.

The problem with statement "depression is lack of serotonin" is the same as with "being overweight is due to eating too much". It is factually true, seems like an easy solution and yet is mired with lots of problems.

The problem with medication is that it treats the symptom (lack of serotonin) rather than the underlying problem (how did we get there in the first place?) Kinda like telling somebody to loose weight by restricting their diet before first understanding what caused them to gain fat in the first place. Is your diet composed of garbage? Why is it, is it because you can only cook garbage? Is it because you can't cook and only buy garbage? Is it because you sit whole day and don't exercise? Is it because you are getting depressed and make it up with food?

The treatment should address the causes of the problem and not just the symptom.

Re: Most people on antidepressants don’t need them

#80

I can tell this thread is going to be a nightmare but whatever I really want to share my experience in case there are people similar to me that need to hear this: I cannot emphasise enough how much Escitalopram (lexapro) has helped me with issues I didn't even know I had until I started taking it. At which point I realised I was living in a constant state of anxiety up to that point, and I probably should have been o…

Me too! I used to be anxious about everything going on in my life. When I started Lexapro and it finally started working, I realized, "Wow, is that what normalcy feels like?" It's been a lifesaver.

So we're the drugs able to help you get past the anxiety enough to figure out what the root was or assist in CBT? I always fear that psych drugs are used to mask the root cause.
Post reply on HN