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Ask HN: Has anyone managed to find enjoyment in their work after burnout?

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Re: Ask HN: Has anyone managed to find enjoyment in their work after burnout?

#311

This advice is going to be hated by a lot of people but.. care less. You’re in an industry that values your skills and seems to always have demand. Whether or not that’s true in the future, it certainly is today , so the best thing you can do is put yourself first and worry less about work as a whole. Especially if it’s not your own company. Spend more time on you, on activities with friends and family, on hobbies. I…

Having a good life outside of work is a great goal but I've been lucky enough that the first 25 years of my career I actually fully enjoyed going to work.

I know people will dismiss this because of the reputation of the industry but I worked in video games. Teams were small (10-30 people). I was not just a cog but had a roll that let me feel the games I shipped were my project. I'm not saying I led the project but the way I might be proud to show off some art I made, I was proud to be making the game. It was mine, not just some item on a jira ticket. I rarely hated going into work. It was like being paid to work on my own project and with cool people I liked collaborating with.

Then I switched to FANG. Now I get paid TC of 2x-6x, I get 2x/2.5x more vacation. I have zero crunch. Lots of other perks. And..... I hate my work life. I have no interest in the work. It's not mine. I don't feel any attachment to what I do. The team is large so no sense of ownership.

Of course, maybe finding work you enjoy is as rare as being a rockstar. Maybe I just got super lucky. But damit, I miss enjoying work to the level I used to.

Re: Ask HN: Has anyone managed to find enjoyment in their work after burnout?

#312
In about the same boat, but I'm in the midst of channeling anger and frustration into trying to make a way figure out why people don't seem to "get it", and in general suck at saying what they mean, your truly included.

I long ago came to terms with the fact a lot of problems when working with technical systems arise out of the human side of things. People saying they did this, but they actually did that. People staying silent out of fear of looking daft, or hoping to $deity they don't attract attention to themselves. People saying they understand when they demonstrably do not.

I guess I had a slight shift in life goal. I'm no longer all about just learning/driving/using computers, but actively trying to get at the root of what makes it so difficult for people to bridge the gap/learn them well enough to use them.

Particularly since there are so many problems with other complex systems you can't even recognize until you've had the epiphany that nothing is magic, and if you didn't do it, it's not a safe assumption to think it'll just work, you can't even begin to approach trying to understand that they are fundamentally broken.

Re: Ask HN: Has anyone managed to find enjoyment in their work after burnout?

#313

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm on track with retirement and savings, but do you know what would put me immediately off track? an unpaid sabbatical with bad health insurance.

Well obviously if you are so sick that the only way for you to survive, financially and literally, is to have employer paid health insurance then ok don't take a sabbatical. This is of course a US-centric problem and would be absurd to basically anyone outside the US.

You don't even have to be "so sick"! for a family of 4 health insurance from a state exchange costs $1,000 a month and can come with a $7k per-person deductible. That's a minor car accident away from $26k in healthcare costs ($14k family deductible + $12k in annual premiums)...

Re: Ask HN: Has anyone managed to find enjoyment in their work after burnout?

#314

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This ^^^^. I am in my thirty ninth year in embedded development, started the year I turned 27. (yeah, do the math) I have strictly limited myself to 40 hour weeks following a severe burnout in the late 1990s. I could retire now, if I had to, but I hope to do this for another three to five years. It is just far too interesting and fun. I had an older coworker that worked full time until he was 74. He also just enjoyed…

Right on! Do you have any resources to share that you've found excellent such as books or articles? Any projects you've enjoyed? Do you hack with any of the new languages? Do you have a blog? I'm always curious and work in the web space and think this sounds interesting. Thank you!

Not who you asked, but I found this course and considering doing it: https://www.udemy.com/course/mcu_msp430/

Re: Ask HN: Has anyone managed to find enjoyment in their work after burnout?

#315

This advice is going to be hated by a lot of people but.. care less. You’re in an industry that values your skills and seems to always have demand. Whether or not that’s true in the future, it certainly is today , so the best thing you can do is put yourself first and worry less about work as a whole. Especially if it’s not your own company. Spend more time on you, on activities with friends and family, on hobbies. I…

Yeah this is solid advice. I'm on year 17 in the industry and year 5 of "care less" which has really turned into "care very little, if at all". I work for a FAANG and while I procrastinate like crazy (btw I have very bad ADHD, so factor that in), I still tend to complete my work on time or ahead of schedule. I do the bare minimum though and I don't give a damn about the job at all beyond that. I haven't put in an hon…

> I do the bare minimum though and I don't give a damn about the job at all beyond that. I haven't put in an honest 40 hours in years. I try to cram all my real work into a 2-3 hour block of time each day. Somehow my managers are still very happy with my output and I still get offered promotions ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Shit, I can't consistently do more than 3-5 hours of "real work" each day.

My wife just started a WFH office job, after years in a career where she spent a lot of time on her feet, working very socially and responding to things moment-to-moment (though not without planning in the mix). I felt validated in my capacity for staring-at-a-screen work when, after a couple days, she remarked to me that now she understood why I felt brain-dead in the evenings—she finds this way more draining than what she used to do, even though on-paper I think her old career should have been harder in many ways.

The fucking glowing screens are powered mostly by sucking out energy from the user, I swear.

Re: Ask HN: Has anyone managed to find enjoyment in their work after burnout?

#316
post #249
post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Getting bored is not a burnout.

I could have worded that better. I think it is in indication that burnout is headed your way. When you don't want to a do a job anymore that you used to like doing (bored if it) and you are being forced to continue doing it, burnout is about to happen.

It's possible there are many different paths to the clinical end state, but for me burnout had nothing to do with boredom at all. It also didn't feel like being bored when it has set on.

Re: Ask HN: Has anyone managed to find enjoyment in their work after burnout?

#317
I had similar feelings at my old job, and tried a bunch of band-aid solutions: setting boundaries, spending more time on hobbies, exercising more, caring less. None of these tactics had the same impact as quitting my job and taking a sabbatical.

Some things that were useful when I was thinking about quitting:

1. Auditing my assets to see what I could pull from on short notice without impacting my tax situation or retirement savings.

2. Reviewing this guide (https://www.academia.edu/9672192/MDD_Major_Depressive_Disord...) to verify that I was burnt out and not depressed; I didn't want to quit if I was depressed and not burned out. Had I been depressed, the move would have been to get on therapy through my company insurance.

3. Journaling about how I felt, what I didn't like at my job, and what I was looking forward to on break.

I don't know if I'll go back to the same type of work or industry, but my time spent reflecting on my goals, enjoying hobbies, and sleeping is already paying off tremendously.

I see some people mentioning the stress of not having a job during an economic downturn, but I find there's a certain amount of peace to it; I've already lost my job so I don't have to worry about that happening in the future.

Re: Ask HN: Has anyone managed to find enjoyment in their work after burnout?

#318
post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That depends on what you do with that. You can also look at this as an investment in yourself that will substantially increase your income later. If you have something to show for it after you sabbatical, you can actually win long term.

> If you have something to show for it after you sabbatical this is also a terrifying concept: what if I don't?

It's entirely possible that you take a long break from work and find that you don't want to do anything. That means that you burned out completely. Just say that in an interview - that you needed to take a serious mental break, recharge, find your new orbit, and decide what you wanted to do next.

If you look for a job a bit later, it's actually easier than looking for it right after when you find yourself unemployed ;)

Re: Ask HN: Has anyone managed to find enjoyment in their work after burnout?

#319
I did, but it required taking a 4 month bit of self-exile and then starting a new place within the industry (different vertical) such that there was enough familiarity for me to not feel totally un-moored, but enough newness to make it fresh and engaging for me to figure out new problems.

Re: Ask HN: Has anyone managed to find enjoyment in their work after burnout?

#320
I had burnout for a while and I couldn't realize it. I had feelings of unease and some mounting evidence of "something wrong" going on in my life. I felt tired, angry, and more. All sorts of negative emotions... The impact on my work was big.

I think a bunch of people here advise to "care less", but in my case I realized it was hard for me to care more because I was in pain... (emotional, physically tired, etc).

Things started to change when I paid closer attention to my environment.

.Make sure you pick your friendships carefully. A crisis is a good chance to see who's reliable in your life. When receiving good advice, it is easy to ignore it or dismiss it. Really pay attention to trustworthy advise.

.Maybe controversial but... I stopped “giving for free”. You may not be standing on a place where you can be so generous. It can be draining to be selfless. So, still help people, be kind and generous, but do it for people that deserve it. Giving while being con, manipulated, or gaslighted depletes your energy and resources.

.Don't be controlled by your emotions, but also don't ignore your gut feelings ... factor them in while making decisions. Avoid extremes.

.Remove people from your life that may be harming you. Gaslighting has become a buzzword but for a reason... Beware of this and other kinds of psychopathic behaviors [1].

.Cut off whatever is not helping your main objective. Avoid having too many goals, projects and hobbies at once.

.Get rid of “ambiguous friendships": If you ever asked yourself, is this person really my friend? ... I'd say, it is likely they aren’t.

.Some side activities may not be bad per-se, but avoid exposing yourself to an energy draining environment. Say, belonging to some sort of team, like sports or dance, where nobody ever is on the same page. Even “good” activities like fitness related ones, could be consuming too much time? Perhaps refocus is needed.

In short, my environment was draining me of my ability to feel engaged at work. Some things in my life were not even bad per-se, but it was a problem of lack of focus: I identified my main source of stress (my lack of engagement with work), but found that removing all the energy drainers and distractors made it a lot easier to engage with work.

1: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gaslighting

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