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Our moon has been slowly drifting away from Earth over the past 2.5B yrs

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41–50 of 89 posts

Re: Our moon has been slowly drifting away from Earth over the past 2.5B yrs

#41

All nations of the world must band together to build a harpoon, of immensity and grandness the likes of which has never seen before. The moon cannot be allowed to escape.

You would have her imprisoned, covered in metal burka, hosting terran colonists till her end? If you really love her, you should let her go.

Re: Our moon has been slowly drifting away from Earth over the past 2.5B yrs

#42

I feel sorry for our future colleagues software developers, that will have to deal with calendars, public holidays and all other stuff related to the lunar calendar. There are many religions that use the lunar cycles as basis for their calculations: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lunar_calendar

Lunar calendar? How about the rotation of the earth? I imagine the further out it gets, the further out our moment of inertia, the slower the earth spins. Days get longer, but the length of a year stays the same. That'll be a fun one. We would probably have day length deniers/365 purists who believe nothing is changing for centuries.

Re: Our moon has been slowly drifting away from Earth over the past 2.5B yrs

#43
post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This can't be true: you can choose a point behind any sufficiently round satellite where it appears the same size as the star. Perhaps it's the only place we know of on a planet's rocky surface. But most of our solar system's planets with moons don't have rocky surfaces, and we can't detect moons in other systems, so you really mean it's not true from the surface of Mars, Pluto or Charon. Additionally, the moon varie…

Yes, sorry, I should have also wrote "where one can stand".

The Moon Kerberos of Pluto is actually very very close to the size of the sun in the sky (of by being 0.0099° compared to the suns 0.0089°, around 11%), so the earth isn't the only planet (if you count Pluto as planet, otherwise, but it's still a solar body you can stand on where a moon is roughly the size of the sun).

Re: Our moon has been slowly drifting away from Earth over the past 2.5B yrs

#44
post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The surface of the Earth is the only place we know of where a natural satellite appears exactly the same size as the primary / only star.

This can't be true: you can choose a point behind any sufficiently round satellite where it appears the same size as the star. Perhaps it's the only place we know of on a planet's rocky surface. But most of our solar system's planets with moons don't have rocky surfaces, and we can't detect moons in other systems, so you really mean it's not true from the surface of Mars, Pluto or Charon. Additionally, the moon varie…

We are actually pretty close to having found "exomoons"(natural satellite orbiting an exoplanet), with several promising candidates having been identified already.

David Kipping's Cool Worlds lab at Columbia has done some promising research on this, some of which is detailed in excellent videos on their youtube channel.

Re: Our moon has been slowly drifting away from Earth over the past 2.5B yrs

#45
post #6

> We found that the moon was around 60,000 kilometers closer to the Earth then [2.46 billion years ago] (that distance is about 1.5 times the circumference of Earth). This would make the length of a day much shorter than it is now, at roughly 17 hours rather than the current 24 hours. I wish they explained why the moon being that much closer would have such a dramatic effect on the day length. Can someone explain thi…

> wish they explained why the moon being that much closer would have such a dramatic effect on the day length. Can someone explain this? Seems off to me, but I'm very physics-naive

Earth-Moon momentum is conserved.

Think of a pregnant woman (the Earth) spinning on a seivel chair. The woman gives birth to her child (the Moon) and she takes the child in her arms and extends it at arm's length.

Their rotation slows down, just like an iceskater slows down when spinning and extending their arms.

The Earth does not have phisical arms holding the Moon, but it has gravity and the Moon also has gravity that affects the ocean tides -- the tidal effects are like tiny tiny arms that both the Earth and the Moon use to push eachother away (and lose a lot of energy in the process also).

The Earth is losing rotational momentum at the expense of the Moon, which is gaining momentum and increasing speed in traveling around the Earth which increases the centrifugal force which means the Moon goes to a higher and higher orbit and further and further away from Earth.

Re: Our moon has been slowly drifting away from Earth over the past 2.5B yrs

#46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If the moon's orbit is increasing in radius, doesn't that mean its orbital velocity is decreasing? Which way is energy being transferred? This stuff confuses me.

Its relative velocity with respect to a Cartesian frame of reference fixed on the surface of the Earth may be dropping, but that's not particularly meaningful. Think of the moon being in free fall, without any external forces acting on it. It would be moving at a constant velocity in a straight line, except the space and time it is in is curved due to gravity. Because of that curved spacetime, the moon appears to acc…

Just a comment on your second and third paragraphs: it's a bit odd that you invoke general relativity ("curved spacetime") for the Moon's basic orbit, and then discuss classical mechanics ("tidal forces are literal forces") for the second-order effects. Tidal forces are of course also gravitational effects, just differential (i.e., the result of the fact that we are not talking about point masses, but rather extended objects).

Re: Our moon has been slowly drifting away from Earth over the past 2.5B yrs

#47

I feel sorry for our future colleagues software developers, that will have to deal with calendars, public holidays and all other stuff related to the lunar calendar. There are many religions that use the lunar cycles as basis for their calculations: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lunar_calendar

Lunar calendar? How about the rotation of the earth? I imagine the further out it gets, the further out our moment of inertia, the slower the earth spins. Days get longer, but the length of a year stays the same. That'll be a fun one. We would probably have day length deniers/365 purists who believe nothing is changing for centuries.

A 360 day year would be kind of neat. We could ave a perfect 6 week calendar, with 60 weeks, 5 per months, every month 30 days.

Re: Our moon has been slowly drifting away from Earth over the past 2.5B yrs

#48
Despite the rapid devolvement of the Moon’s rotational at its own polar axis (to a point of having one face of the Moon being tidal locked toward Earth) since its birthing from Earth, I remain curious about the breakage of such tidal locking as Moon’s orbit dramatically continues to expand.

Re: Our moon has been slowly drifting away from Earth over the past 2.5B yrs

#49
post #45
post #6

> We found that the moon was around 60,000 kilometers closer to the Earth then [2.46 billion years ago] (that distance is about 1.5 times the circumference of Earth). This would make the length of a day much shorter than it is now, at roughly 17 hours rather than the current 24 hours. I wish they explained why the moon being that much closer would have such a dramatic effect on the day length. Can someone explain thi…

> wish they explained why the moon being that much closer would have such a dramatic effect on the day length. Can someone explain this? Seems off to me, but I'm very physics-naive Earth-Moon momentum is conserved. Think of a pregnant woman (the Earth) spinning on a seivel chair. The woman gives birth to her child (the Moon) and she takes the child in her arms and extends it at arm's length. Their rotation slows down…

> Think of a pregnant woman (the Earth) spinning on a seivel chair. The woman gives birth to her child (the Moon) and she takes the child in her arms and extends it at arm's length.

Just in case any of you were thinking of patenting this idea, I'm afraid that someone beat you to it: https://patents.google.com/patent/US3216423A/en

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