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Lufthansa abandons AirTag ban

arstechnica.com

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Re: Lufthansa abandons AirTag ban

#81

Post by duxup »

danpalmer wrote: post #69
prange wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What makes you think a customer service rep is operating the official Twitter account for a $40+BN company?

The fact that Twitter is a customer service channel, the tweet was sent with "Qualtrics Social Connect" which describes itself as a customer service tool, the fact that there was a personal sign-off on the tweet which big companies don't tend to do when they're making policy announcements, but that they do tend to do when a customer service rep is replying to a customer question. Plenty of large companies do this sor…

Not to disagree with your characterization of the tweet or response to the user, but what's the end point then?

"Don't believe our official twitter account if you think customer service is involved?"

I have trouble faulting anyone for believing what was a very clear statement on their official twitter account.

Re: Lufthansa abandons AirTag ban

#82

Post by monksy »

InTheArena wrote: post #7

Classic. Someone gets a lower-level customer service rep on twitter to make a statement based on incorrect and incomplete information about Airtags in compliance with regulation. Media blows it up into this insane thing, that Lufthansa is evil, and doesn't want you to track your bags, so they can lose it with no repercussions. Lufthansa clarifies things (once again, in line with law) - and then the media uses works l…

> Someone gets a lower-level customer service rep on twitter to make a statement based on incorrect and incomplete information about Airtags in compliance with regulation.

I can't believe that someone pressured a lower level customer service. From my experience, they (the employees) decided to make up a new rule that benefited them.

Re: Lufthansa abandons AirTag ban

#83

Post by monksy »

INTPenis wrote: post #62
nmilo wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then maybe it's time that lower-level customer service reps stop running official company twitter accounts. Maybe you and I see it differently, but most of the world sees a company's twitter account as the official source of information and fast-paced updates. It has as much significance as a press release from the CEO or an announcement on the company website. So if the lower-level customer service rep fucks up, out…

You're going after the wrong people here. Journalists hungry for clickbait can't wait for incompetent customer reps to tweet some stupid shit. So the "journalist" can blow it out of proportion. It's literally their bread and butter.

Normally I would agree with you.

Until there is new information presented, I will continue to assert that they have not changed. (That first part of the sentence is copied from verbatim from a CSR email when explaining an exceptionally bad experience with them)

Re: Lufthansa abandons AirTag ban

#84

Post by monksy »

TillE wrote: post #16
InTheArena wrote: post #7

Classic. Someone gets a lower-level customer service rep on twitter to make a statement based on incorrect and incomplete information about Airtags in compliance with regulation. Media blows it up into this insane thing, that Lufthansa is evil, and doesn't want you to track your bags, so they can lose it with no repercussions. Lufthansa clarifies things (once again, in line with law) - and then the media uses works l…

It's definitely scummy journalism, but there's also a little misunderstanding in how social media reps work in Germany vs elsewhere. Basically in Germany, they tend to operate with considerably more autonomy. It is not uncommon to see official Twitter accounts arguing with customers, where in the US you'd probably just get a canned response or ignored if you're sufficiently rude. So I'm not surprised that someone lik…

> , they tend to operate with considerably more autonomy.

That's one way to put it.

Another way to put it is:

> They tend to operate without much oversight or ethical boundaries.

Re: Lufthansa abandons AirTag ban

#85

Post by ramblerman »

nmilo wrote: post #32
InTheArena wrote: post #7

Classic. Someone gets a lower-level customer service rep on twitter to make a statement based on incorrect and incomplete information about Airtags in compliance with regulation. Media blows it up into this insane thing, that Lufthansa is evil, and doesn't want you to track your bags, so they can lose it with no repercussions. Lufthansa clarifies things (once again, in line with law) - and then the media uses works l…

Then maybe it's time that lower-level customer service reps stop running official company twitter accounts. Maybe you and I see it differently, but most of the world sees a company's twitter account as the official source of information and fast-paced updates. It has as much significance as a press release from the CEO or an announcement on the company website. So if the lower-level customer service rep fucks up, out…

No, outrage is warranted when countries go to war.

This kind of nonsense activism hurts us all.

Re: Lufthansa abandons AirTag ban

#86

Post by tlogan »

InTheArena wrote: post #7

Classic. Someone gets a lower-level customer service rep on twitter to make a statement based on incorrect and incomplete information about Airtags in compliance with regulation. Media blows it up into this insane thing, that Lufthansa is evil, and doesn't want you to track your bags, so they can lose it with no repercussions. Lufthansa clarifies things (once again, in line with law) - and then the media uses works l…

I do not know… it seems like Lufthansa messed up here.

Lufthansa official twitter account clearly said: “Hi David, Lufthansa is banning activated AirTags from luggage as they are classified as dangerous and need to be turned off./Mony”

So are you saying that official Lufthansa twitter account is some low level employee? So I should not trust messages posted on their twitter account?

I fly Lufthansa a lot and I follow their twitter account thinking that is official account to update me rafting different rules (COVID, etc.)

If they made a mistake that is ok: they should imeditatelly tweet again and said that. There will be no “crazy media”. But nope - nobody even customer service (I call them) did not know.

Re: Lufthansa abandons AirTag ban

#87

Post by bonestamp2 »

nmilo wrote: post #32
InTheArena wrote: post #7

Classic. Someone gets a lower-level customer service rep on twitter to make a statement based on incorrect and incomplete information about Airtags in compliance with regulation. Media blows it up into this insane thing, that Lufthansa is evil, and doesn't want you to track your bags, so they can lose it with no repercussions. Lufthansa clarifies things (once again, in line with law) - and then the media uses works l…

Then maybe it's time that lower-level customer service reps stop running official company twitter accounts. Maybe you and I see it differently, but most of the world sees a company's twitter account as the official source of information and fast-paced updates. It has as much significance as a press release from the CEO or an announcement on the company website. So if the lower-level customer service rep fucks up, out…

I think you're both right in different ways -- part of the problem is operations...

A friend of mine operates social media (at a tactical level) for a very large company and it sounds like they have a good set of operating guidelines in place to prevent problems like Lufthansa has here.

Now, most of his job is just replying to the same questions all day long (and he has a small team of people to handle the volume). All of the information they give out has been pre-approved, but once in awhile something new comes along and he runs it up the flag pole to marketing and/or legal before adding it to his list of approved replies.

Additionally, he works with the communications department, sales, and marketing to create planned communications. His expertise is in social media, and he guides the communications from the other departments on what will work well on social media. But he rarely comes up with the actual message.

Re: Lufthansa abandons AirTag ban

#88

Post by endisneigh »

capableweb wrote: post #17
endisneigh wrote: post #11

Is it even possible to ban AirTags? How exactly would that work? Even if you made the cargo hold a literal faraday cage, presumably as soon as you move the luggage the mesh network will be active again and immediately reconcile the location, which is what the user would want anyway.

Same way illegal drugs are banned, pass everything through a scanner that detects the illegal thing. In this case, it would a UWB (and/or BLE and/or NFC, AirTags seems to use all three technologies) detector that flags any bags for manual inspection. Not saying banning it is right/wrong, just that there definitely is a way of detecting them if you really want to.

How would you distinguish devices that use the sake protocols from the AirTags with the current scanners? There would likely be thousands in an airport at a given time.

How would you stop someone from taking out the battery and replacing it after security, or cross airline luggage transfer of devices with AirTags?

Enforcement of a ban without customs level scrutiny seems impractical.

Re: Lufthansa abandons AirTag ban

#89

Post by RealStickman_ »

monksy wrote: post #84
TillE wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's definitely scummy journalism, but there's also a little misunderstanding in how social media reps work in Germany vs elsewhere. Basically in Germany, they tend to operate with considerably more autonomy. It is not uncommon to see official Twitter accounts arguing with customers, where in the US you'd probably just get a canned response or ignored if you're sufficiently rude. So I'm not surprised that someone lik…

> , they tend to operate with considerably more autonomy. That's one way to put it. Another way to put it is: > They tend to operate without much oversight or ethical boundaries.

Anothernother way to put it is:

> They seem more approachable with possibly more positive interactions.

Re: Lufthansa abandons AirTag ban

#90

Post by capableweb »

endisneigh wrote: post #88
capableweb wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Same way illegal drugs are banned, pass everything through a scanner that detects the illegal thing. In this case, it would a UWB (and/or BLE and/or NFC, AirTags seems to use all three technologies) detector that flags any bags for manual inspection. Not saying banning it is right/wrong, just that there definitely is a way of detecting them if you really want to.

How would you distinguish devices that use the sake protocols from the AirTags with the current scanners? There would likely be thousands in an airport at a given time. How would you stop someone from taking out the battery and replacing it after security, or cross airline luggage transfer of devices with AirTags? Enforcement of a ban without customs level scrutiny seems impractical.

The bags travel on a conveyor belt, which passes through a scanner that scans one bag at a time. Whenever there is something detected, you know exactly which bag trigger it and it gets redirected to another conveyor belt.
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