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Show HN: Minimal, no-JS web forum software

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Re: Show HN: Minimal, no-JS web forum software

#91

Post by IshKebab »

dmitriid wrote: post #20
make_me_rich wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ohh I miss the good old days of forums in general. I find all this new software, where conversions* are "threaded" stupidly hard to read. Even worse, when the software is trying to recommend to you, what to read. Back in the day you had a thread, every post to that thread was chronologically added to that thread and in case you wanted to reply to someone, you quoted them... sigh EDITED: *conversations

Threaded conversations are really good because you can have branching discussions that don't interfere with each other. But the only forum I know of that realised how to properly do it is this old Russian software forum [1] You need a mail client-like interface so that you can see your place in the discussion. Triple quoting someone and trying to read the actual thread in a flat forum sucked then and sucks now. [1] E…

Check out the D language forums. Easily the best forum software I've seen.

Re: Show HN: Minimal, no-JS web forum software

#92

Post by IshKebab »

make_me_rich wrote: post #6
tiffanyh wrote: post #2

I commend you for hand rolling it all and not using JS. I miss the days of good ole forum software (e.g. FluxBB/PunBB) before it was superseded with massive JS bloat/clunky forum software like Discourse, Flarum, etc.

Ohh I miss the good old days of forums in general. I find all this new software, where conversions* are "threaded" stupidly hard to read. Even worse, when the software is trying to recommend to you, what to read. Back in the day you had a thread, every post to that thread was chronologically added to that thread and in case you wanted to reply to someone, you quoted them... sigh EDITED: *conversations

I too miss the good old days where the information you wanted was buried somewhere in a 100 page phpBB thread and you had to manually search through it 1 page at a time, with each one-line comment taking up half the page with avatars and signatures.

Good times. Sad that things have moved on to systems that don't suck quite so much but that's progress for you.

Re: Show HN: Minimal, no-JS web forum software

#93

Post by onlyrealcuzzo »

tiffanyh wrote: post #2

I commend you for hand rolling it all and not using JS. I miss the days of good ole forum software (e.g. FluxBB/PunBB) before it was superseded with massive JS bloat/clunky forum software like Discourse, Flarum, etc.

The point of no-js is mainly to avoid client-side tracking, right?

Can't you do a lot of that with CSS?

Re: Show HN: Minimal, no-JS web forum software

#94

Post by tonetheman »

Aperocky wrote: post #83

May I recommend an ORM for any such project? hand rolling SQL statement aren't going to scale. Here's my shameless plug: `pip install sqlitedao`: https://github.com/Aperocky/sqlitedao

My experience is the exact opposite.

ORM's never scale and you end up with hand written SQL long term. Unless it is really just a CRUD app then ORM's really work fairly well.

Re: Show HN: Minimal, no-JS web forum software

#95

Post by bityard »

Aperocky wrote: post #83

May I recommend an ORM for any such project? hand rolling SQL statement aren't going to scale. Here's my shameless plug: `pip install sqlitedao`: https://github.com/Aperocky/sqlitedao

I get the impression that OP's project is not aiming for scale.

Re: Show HN: Minimal, no-JS web forum software

#96

Post by Aperocky »

tonetheman wrote: post #94
Aperocky wrote: post #83

May I recommend an ORM for any such project? hand rolling SQL statement aren't going to scale. Here's my shameless plug: `pip install sqlitedao`: https://github.com/Aperocky/sqlitedao

My experience is the exact opposite. ORM's never scale and you end up with hand written SQL long term. Unless it is really just a CRUD app then ORM's really work fairly well.

On a personal and professional level it has been the opposite case for me.

Re: Show HN: Minimal, no-JS web forum software

#97

Post by NoraCodes »

gcanyon wrote: post #76
quickthrower2 wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Terrible user experience. If it infinitely scrolls I can be sure some gesture on the phone will lose my spot and it will take ages to find where I was. Also they rarely play nice with the back button. There is usually a better way to present data. For reading, do you prefer books or ancient scrolls?

Apollo (reddit client on iOS) solves this by having the same gesture undo itself -- tap at the top to scroll to the top of the reddit post, tap again to return to where you were. I'm not saying your complaint is invalid, just that there are ways of mitigating the issue. And that said, I can't imagine how reddit threads would work if paginated.

> I can't imagine how reddit threads would work if paginated.

Presumably similarly to HackerNews threads, which are paginated.

Re: Show HN: Minimal, no-JS web forum software

#98

Post by bulatb »

moffkalast wrote: post #85
tiffanyh wrote: post #2

I commend you for hand rolling it all and not using JS. I miss the days of good ole forum software (e.g. FluxBB/PunBB) before it was superseded with massive JS bloat/clunky forum software like Discourse, Flarum, etc.

I do still wonder why the fast and responsive software can't invest a little bit into design in order to not look like complete shit. Sure something like phpBB is light, but the UX is also barely usable. Give me something like Reddit or Discourse over that any day. Why can't we have the best of both worlds? Hackernews on the other hand manages to lack both (in some speculations intentionally), with neither usable des…

FOSS tends to treat aesthetics like developers complain executives treat software quality: This doesn't help me. Why does it matter? Why should I care? I see no difference.

Improving either is an uphill battle when decision makers don't value the work, at best, or at worst are committed to resistance. And you don't even get paid.

Re: Show HN: Minimal, no-JS web forum software

#99

Post by Aperocky »

softfalcon wrote: post #86
Aperocky wrote: post #83

May I recommend an ORM for any such project? hand rolling SQL statement aren't going to scale. Here's my shameless plug: `pip install sqlitedao`: https://github.com/Aperocky/sqlitedao

Not trying to bash your ORM as it could have a great translation layer to make optimal queries. my experience optimizing SQL has been removing the ORM layer via hand rolling SQL queries. Most of my peers also seem to agree that ORM is great for knocking a feature out, but you’ll inevitably run into performance concerns at scale and need to write your own optimized queries yourself. I feel like with SQLite having limi…

A well thought out ORM would consider for performance, obviously if you're just retrieving a particular string then manual SQL might have a few times speed lead.

The fundamental issue with both handrolled SQL and ORM is inefficient queries leading to linearly increasing time consumption. for instance usage of `LIMIT` and accidentally querying on non-indexed fields. But I don't see how this differentiate the 2 as I have seen it happen in both situations professionally.

A good ORM enforces certain behaviors, specifically querying by index and constant time pagination. This guards against accidental querying behaviors.

Re: Show HN: Minimal, no-JS web forum software

#100

Post by leviathan »

Xeoncross wrote: post #56

That reminded me of the 1KB forum: https://nerdparadise.com/programming/phpforum I actually shortened it, expanded it to add bot detection and published the update also under 1KB: https://gist.github.com/Xeoncross/1503594 Such abuse PHP could handle back then.

Holy sql injection Batman
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