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Protests in Iran: State-run live TV hacked by protesters

bbc.co.uk

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Re: Protests in Iran: State-run live TV hacked by protesters

#71

Post by jdmonty »

fritztastic wrote: post #63
unity1001 wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> This is a very simplistic view of the tensions in the region That is a very simplistic, and correct view of how the US manipulates such tensions. There are many of us international HNers, whose countries suffered multiple US backed coups or color revolutions, and even worse, whose grassroots popular movements were co-opted and subverted by the US. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solidarity_(Polish_trade_union... So m…

As someone from one of those countries, I'm well aware. I'm not saying the US, and/or proxies of the agendas of the powerful who stand to gain from exploitation and meddling, aren't involved. I would expect they are very much involved, and I would be very skeptical of any claim they aren't. What I'm saying is simply that despite this, people in those places could conceivably be independently fed up- and their dissati…

I agree but what you’re missing from threat modeling is relative capability of actors. And yes not there’s degrees of of organic discontent which is key to amplifying or muting etc. they’ll have intelligence and adapt vectors. For example the girl was killed is a fact. The trick is building narrative and this is where likely lies of omission or exaggeration or semantics come in in e.g. girl is dead, it’s evil repressive regimes fault, we demand justice. Not perfect science for sure

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Re: Protests in Iran: State-run live TV hacked by protesters

#72

Post by unity1001 »

fritztastic wrote: post #63
unity1001 wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> This is a very simplistic view of the tensions in the region That is a very simplistic, and correct view of how the US manipulates such tensions. There are many of us international HNers, whose countries suffered multiple US backed coups or color revolutions, and even worse, whose grassroots popular movements were co-opted and subverted by the US. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solidarity_(Polish_trade_union... So m…

As someone from one of those countries, I'm well aware. I'm not saying the US, and/or proxies of the agendas of the powerful who stand to gain from exploitation and meddling, aren't involved. I would expect they are very much involved, and I would be very skeptical of any claim they aren't. What I'm saying is simply that despite this, people in those places could conceivably be independently fed up- and their dissati…

> How this plays out over time

How this plays out over time is either of the two: 1) The protests fail, either due to the momentum fading or the government suppressing 2) The protests succeed, and the country gets a US backed government. Along with all the privatization, removal of labor protections and social welfare, decline in life standards.

Unfortunately, there hasnt been any case of the protesters somehow being able to avert that while still succeeding. Because such protests and movements need organization to succeed. And if there wasnt an indigenous, powerful source of such organization present in the country for a long time, the organization will be coming from those who are backed by the US.

A US backed government would mean hell for both Saudis and Iranis - Saudi Arabia has VERY extensive social programs that literally guarantee everyone's comfort, life and education. Iran does not have those, but it still has enough such programs and the traditional cultural relations and social fabric is still alive. Those tend to get destroyed in the first wave of privatizations and 'free marketization'.

Re: Protests in Iran: State-run live TV hacked by protesters

#73

Post by MickerNews »

yorwba wrote: post #67
MickerNews wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quoted post unavailable.

If you don't like Wikipedia, how about the Chinese government's official arrest statistics? https://web.archive.org/web/20180725042225/https://www.nchrd... Just click on the numbers in the table to verify that they match the original Chinese source. Of course you can choose to believe that the Internet Archive is in on the conspiracy, in which case you cannot be helped. Or you can choose to believe that Chinese polic…

[flagged]

Re: Protests in Iran: State-run live TV hacked by protesters

#75

Post by msoad »

seer-zig wrote: post #65
nayaketo wrote: post #31

Don't know about CIA conspiracies but I'm sure Saudi Arabians will protest Hijab mandates one day. Freedom is amazing and every human craves it at some level.

Ah yes, the typical astounding secular definition of freedom, equating it with nakedness and vices. I’ll tell you something, the vast majority of the Saudis are proud of the Hijab and their Islamic faith that promotes purity and decency. We don’t want the western definition of “freedom” thank you very much, we’ve seen where it leads

No post body was provided.

Re: Protests in Iran: State-run live TV hacked by protesters

#76

Post by [deleted] »

seer-zig wrote: post #65
nayaketo wrote: post #31

Don't know about CIA conspiracies but I'm sure Saudi Arabians will protest Hijab mandates one day. Freedom is amazing and every human craves it at some level.

Ah yes, the typical astounding secular definition of freedom, equating it with nakedness and vices. I’ll tell you something, the vast majority of the Saudis are proud of the Hijab and their Islamic faith that promotes purity and decency. We don’t want the western definition of “freedom” thank you very much, we’ve seen where it leads

[deleted]

Re: Protests in Iran: State-run live TV hacked by protesters

#77

Post by boomboomsubban »

avgcorrection wrote: post #41
photochemsyn wrote: post #19

Given the recent split between the USA and Saudi Arabia over crude oil production targets, I wouldn't be surprised to see similar hacking of Saudi news feeds by 'domestic protestors' and a new US State Department focus on 'human rights and democratic reforms in the repressive Saudi dictatorship' coming up pretty quickly. This would be a radical shift from US behavior during the Arab Spring, when the USA gave a wink a…

Perhaps. But these things are not signs of that since the American government has hated the Iranian government for a long time. It would be much more suspicious if the US govt. started to support the Iranian govt. all of a sudden.

You don't think they'd try to change a government they've hated for a long time? I would also find a sudden 180 on Iran suspicious, but also would not be surprised if any Iranian opposition group had US support.

Re: Protests in Iran: State-run live TV hacked by protesters

#78

Post by anthk »

seer-zig wrote: post #65
nayaketo wrote: post #31

Don't know about CIA conspiracies but I'm sure Saudi Arabians will protest Hijab mandates one day. Freedom is amazing and every human craves it at some level.

Ah yes, the typical astounding secular definition of freedom, equating it with nakedness and vices. I’ll tell you something, the vast majority of the Saudis are proud of the Hijab and their Islamic faith that promotes purity and decency. We don’t want the western definition of “freedom” thank you very much, we’ve seen where it leads

No post body was provided.

Re: Protests in Iran: State-run live TV hacked by protesters

#79

Post by futhey »

photochemsyn wrote: post #19

Given the recent split between the USA and Saudi Arabia over crude oil production targets, I wouldn't be surprised to see similar hacking of Saudi news feeds by 'domestic protestors' and a new US State Department focus on 'human rights and democratic reforms in the repressive Saudi dictatorship' coming up pretty quickly. This would be a radical shift from US behavior during the Arab Spring, when the USA gave a wink a…

People read too much into the recent production target cuts. An important thing to consider is that OPEC+ has been failing to meet their targets by about the same amount for several months now, and most experts seem to believe they lack capacity, not the will to produce.

https://markets.businessinsider.com/news/commodities/opec-mi...

Re: Protests in Iran: State-run live TV hacked by protesters

#80

Post by anigbrowl »

fritztastic wrote: post #35
photochemsyn wrote: post #19

Given the recent split between the USA and Saudi Arabia over crude oil production targets, I wouldn't be surprised to see similar hacking of Saudi news feeds by 'domestic protestors' and a new US State Department focus on 'human rights and democratic reforms in the repressive Saudi dictatorship' coming up pretty quickly. This would be a radical shift from US behavior during the Arab Spring, when the USA gave a wink a…

This is a very simplistic view of the tensions in the region, which have been ongoing for decades. Just as the US has reason to retaliate against Saudi Arabia, many other places could also have reasons to push the ruling family out of power and gain influence. It also fails to account for the autonomy of the people there. Is it really so hard to believe that they are rebelling against authoritarianism? Even if there…

No, GP is a legit comment. Everything you say about Iran is also true of Saudi Arabia (in the sense of the ruling regime being autocratic and oppressive) but it's expedient for the establishment in the US to condemn one regime and support the other.
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