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Declassified US nuclear targets – interactive map

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Re: Declassified US nuclear targets – interactive map

#21

Post by hackerlight »

ptr wrote: post #7
chaosbolt wrote: post #2

>Because you invaded a country for no reason (like we did to Iraq), (except the one you invaded is at your borders and we put our guy at its head a couple years ago, and the one we invaded is half a planet from us), we will bring forth the apocalypse. Humans are crazy, seeing how we're speaking about a nuclear war now vs how people spoke about it in the 60s, it's like a mass psychosis, we don't care anymore, or maybe…

I wonder if it’s the Internet’s fault. Maybe people have become so jaded by Online discourse and carry it over into IRL?

Also people in the 60s lived through a nuke (1945) and lived through WW2. That living memory is now gone.

The problem with the "anti-war" crowd right now, is many appear to be closet Putin supporters. Or at least they're so anti-American that they support Putin by default. It would help the anti-war people not in that camp to carefully disambiguate between wanting to reduce the risk of nuclear conflict -- a laudable goal -- and support for Putin's imperial aggression.

Re: Declassified US nuclear targets – interactive map

#22

Post by cm2187 »

chaosbolt wrote: post #2

>Because you invaded a country for no reason (like we did to Iraq), (except the one you invaded is at your borders and we put our guy at its head a couple years ago, and the one we invaded is half a planet from us), we will bring forth the apocalypse. Humans are crazy, seeing how we're speaking about a nuclear war now vs how people spoke about it in the 60s, it's like a mass psychosis, we don't care anymore, or maybe…

I am struggling with the alternative. So a dictator can invade any country he wants because otherwise he can say "booh, nuclear apocalypse" and because we can't risk to be anywhere near that, we need to give the dictator whatever he wants? And the invaded country has to swallow it? It's easy to write off other people's freedom.

This map is very the reason why Putin's threats are empty threats. The US, UK and France have nukes pointed at every single major Russian city, and as far as I am aware, Putin cannot stop them if he were to decide to go that route.

There is nothing in what he has done so far that seems to suggest he is either crazy, suicidal, or doesn't care about his mark on history.

Re: Declassified US nuclear targets – interactive map

#24

Post by _visgean »

RagnarD wrote: post #23

The list includes Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania, Poland (!), Ukraine (!), (east) Germany (!!!), and so forth. To state that this 1956 target list "probably doesn't look dramatically different [from today's]" is one of the most moronic things I've read in a long time.

don't worry, we will get bombed from russia so it wont be that different.

Re: Declassified US nuclear targets – interactive map

#25

Post by hackerlight »

darthrupert wrote: post #15
avgcorrection wrote: post #10

The theory of deterrence is kind of like the idea that the way to stop a bad guy with a gun is to have a good guy with a gun.

... completely valid?

It's not a great analogy.

At the level of states, you have anarchy. This is the key insight of realism. There is no authority that places guardrails on how each state treats each other. So each state needs to arm themselves.

At the level of people, you do not have anarchy. You have police which acts as the hegemon.

Re: Declassified US nuclear targets – interactive map

#26

Post by rjzzleep »

_visgean wrote: post #20
chaosbolt wrote: post #2

>Because you invaded a country for no reason (like we did to Iraq), (except the one you invaded is at your borders and we put our guy at its head a couple years ago, and the one we invaded is half a planet from us), we will bring forth the apocalypse. Humans are crazy, seeing how we're speaking about a nuclear war now vs how people spoke about it in the 60s, it's like a mass psychosis, we don't care anymore, or maybe…

Who are you quoting? > we put our guy at its head a couple years ago https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2019_Ukrainian_presidential_el... this is denying that ukraine has agency of its own. Nobody put a guy anywhere. He was elected. > we will bring forth the apocalypse. The only country that is threating 1st strike is Russia.

No post body was provided.

Re: Declassified US nuclear targets – interactive map

#27

Post by _visgean »

Silverback_VII wrote: post #16
chaosbolt wrote: post #2

>Because you invaded a country for no reason (like we did to Iraq), (except the one you invaded is at your borders and we put our guy at its head a couple years ago, and the one we invaded is half a planet from us), we will bring forth the apocalypse. Humans are crazy, seeing how we're speaking about a nuclear war now vs how people spoke about it in the 60s, it's like a mass psychosis, we don't care anymore, or maybe…

Isn't it the same frenzy with which people advocated for lockdowns, masks and destroyed some peoples careers because they didn't want to take the shot? What I find inspiring is that billionaires like Musk are suddenly making moves to defuse the situation.

> like Musk are suddenly making moves to defuse the situation.

he is parroting russian propaganda word for word. (and russia is also quoting him)

Re: Declassified US nuclear targets – interactive map

#28

Post by galangalalgol »

Rygian wrote: post #19
darthrupert wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

... completely valid?

Rather than thinking in blurry terms like "valid," I would see it more useful to think in terms of how many innocent people will lose their lives when good guy and bad guy use their guns. Any arrangement that makes the number grow is worse than the others.

yeah more like two people holding grenades with the pins out in a crowd saying "don't make me drop this!"

Re: Declassified US nuclear targets – interactive map

#30

Post by TEP_Kim_Il_Sung »

xiphias2 wrote: post #17
TEP_Kim_Il_Sung wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> we will bring forth the apocalypse. This word is often misused. Are you still worried about someone bringing it forth, now that you know what it means? apocalypse (n.) late 14c., "revelation, disclosure," from Church Latin apocalypsis "revelation," from Greek apokalyptein "uncover, disclose, reveal," from apo "off, away from" (see apo-) + kalyptein "to cover, conceal" (from PIE root *kel- (1) "to cover, conceal, sa…

Oxford dictionary: the complete final destruction of the world, as described in the biblical book of Revelation. "the bell's ringing is supposed to usher in the Apocalypse" 2. an event involving destruction or damage on a catastrophic scale. "the apocalypse of World War II" Meanings of words change over time.

>"the apocalypse of World War II"

Arguably, this is about the revealation that civil society is just a thin veneer painted to hide the depraved barbarity of the human condition.

I hope we never have to witness that again.

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