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TikTok Parent ByteDance Sees Losses Swell in Push for Growth

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Re: TikTok Parent ByteDance Sees Losses Swell in Push for Growth

#51

Post by masterof0 »

themitigating wrote: post #25
masterof0 wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't like companies which business model is spying on people , regardless who their master is. To answer your question(if you really want an answer) , is, hypocrisy, many people have a problem with Alice pointing out that Bob did X thing, when Alice in the first place have also done said X thing. Not justifying anything, or anyone whatsoever, just telling raven how some people might think.

Alice and bob are people who committed those things. A citizen in the US has nothing to do with ww2 Japanese internment camps, slavery, etc so it's not hypocrisy to point out what another country is doing.

If your country do those things, some people might feel is hypocritical, because a citizen of {evil_country} have nothing to do with {crimes}. Just because Alice's country did it long ago, doesn't mean Alice have the higher moral ground over Bob. Again, just pointing out what it is. Don't care, TikTok, Facebook, Snapchat,etc can dissappear tomorrow, and I wouldn't notice.

Edit: Typo

Re: TikTok Parent ByteDance Sees Losses Swell in Push for Growth

#52

Post by djanlermats2020 »

dylan604 wrote: post #48
pb7 wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I didn't claim to speak for billions of people.

"You don't speak for the ~7.7B people not in the US." vs "You don't speak for me" One of those comments is speaking for a lot more people

No it isn't, both are correct statements of fact.

Re: TikTok Parent ByteDance Sees Losses Swell in Push for Growth

#53

Post by kersplody »

dylan604 wrote: post #47
pb7 wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At the end of the day, ByteDance can't do anything that clashes with the wishes of the CCP and that is a risk. If it were to attempt to IPO on US exchanges, it would be subject to even more scrutiny.

Yes, what happens to US investment if the CCP steps and and takes over? Why would the CCP refund US investment? Investments come with risk and investing in Chinese companies have this extra bit of risk. The investors can cry about it, but they should have known it as a possible outcome for that investment.

BYTE is a Chinese company: it is co-managed by the CCP by definition and the CCP can and has been able to override the company leadership at anytime it sees fit. Investors knew about this risk from day one and knew that any invested capital would be under effective CCP management. In practice, the CCP has an interest in the growth of the company, however state priorities, like intelligence gathering have precedence.

No one/company should have any expectation of privacy or security when doing business with any company operating in China, Hong Kong, or Macau.

Re: TikTok Parent ByteDance Sees Losses Swell in Push for Growth

#54

Post by ryantgtg »

dylan604 wrote: post #48
pb7 wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I didn't claim to speak for billions of people.

"You don't speak for the ~7.7B people not in the US." vs "You don't speak for me" One of those comments is speaking for a lot more people

Where did you get "you don't speak for me"?

It's "I can tell you that to us you're all the same" vs "You don't speak for the ~7.7B people not in the US."

One person is trying to speak for 7.7B and the other is advising against that.

Re: TikTok Parent ByteDance Sees Losses Swell in Push for Growth

#55

Post by ok123456 »

pb7 wrote: post #26
angio wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But they took part in illegal surveillance programmes in the past.

>illegal Exactly. What's illegal here is perfectly fine in China. Let's not equate the two. US government may get data from US companies but at least it takes a warrant. Chinese government straight up owns the servers.

Yeah the Church Committee in the 70s really reformed the "intelligence community." They learned their lesson and never violated peoples civil rights ever again. And there's so much oversight now!

Re: TikTok Parent ByteDance Sees Losses Swell in Push for Growth

#56

Post by afiori »

walrus01 wrote: post #39
nextstep wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you explain how this is a spy tool and how Youtube, Instagram, Facebook, etc. are not? I haven't really used TikTok. How does it collect data beyond the videos I've watched?

Chinese domestic companies are legally obligated to provide a direct data pipeline from their databases to the Ministry of State Security. It's a real law that exists. Basically imagine what the NSA implemented with the PRISM program revealed by Snowden but formally codified into law and with active participation/engineering efforts required by the corporations.

Is it particularly different from https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CLOUD_Act ?

Re: TikTok Parent ByteDance Sees Losses Swell in Push for Growth

#57

Post by alphabetting »

afiori wrote: post #56
walrus01 wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Chinese domestic companies are legally obligated to provide a direct data pipeline from their databases to the Ministry of State Security. It's a real law that exists. Basically imagine what the NSA implemented with the PRISM program revealed by Snowden but formally codified into law and with active participation/engineering efforts required by the corporations.

Is it particularly different from https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CLOUD_Act ?

Yes

https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/emilybakerwhite/tiktok-...

Re: TikTok Parent ByteDance Sees Losses Swell in Push for Growth

#58

Post by walrus01 »

afiori wrote: post #56
walrus01 wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Chinese domestic companies are legally obligated to provide a direct data pipeline from their databases to the Ministry of State Security. It's a real law that exists. Basically imagine what the NSA implemented with the PRISM program revealed by Snowden but formally codified into law and with active participation/engineering efforts required by the corporations.

Is it particularly different from https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CLOUD_Act ?

It's more like being perpetually subject to a National Security Letter (NSL) warrant issued by a US FISA court, a fairly rare occurrence and specifically targeted, but for blanket database replication and as the widespread legal default for every company in China.

Re: TikTok Parent ByteDance Sees Losses Swell in Push for Growth

#59

Post by exolymph »

satao wrote: post #21
pb7 wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One is controlled by an authoritarian government, the others are private (publicly traded) corporations in a democratic country.

as someone living outside the US I can tell you that to us you're all the same.

you're entitled to your opinion, but for those of us living inside the US, they are not at all the same

Re: TikTok Parent ByteDance Sees Losses Swell in Push for Growth

#60

Post by waffleiron »

afiori wrote: post #56
walrus01 wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Chinese domestic companies are legally obligated to provide a direct data pipeline from their databases to the Ministry of State Security. It's a real law that exists. Basically imagine what the NSA implemented with the PRISM program revealed by Snowden but formally codified into law and with active participation/engineering efforts required by the corporations.

Is it particularly different from https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CLOUD_Act ?

The main difference is that HN is mainly visited by American users, not affected by CLOUD act.
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