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We Burned Down Players’ Houses in Ultima Online

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41–50 of 265 posts

Re: We Burned Down Players’ Houses in Ultima Online

#41

I missed UO's hayday, but when I've played the big modern MMOs I find myself instead attracted to the idea that individual characters shouldn't be able to do everything. I feel like forcing players to interact if they want to gather specific resources or craft vital items would really help a game feel "massively multiplayer". Are there any modern MMOs with mechanics like this, e.g. life-skill limits or some other sou…

The reason UO will never be re-created is that it was the first game of it's kind and thus every player had only one option. In modern times, the gamer population is so bifurcated that I'm not sure it'll ever be possible to have such a mix of player types in a single unforgiving ecosystem.

Re: We Burned Down Players’ Houses in Ultima Online

#42
post #23
post #10

Ultima Online is the only MMO that felt like a true virtual world and not just a grindy RPG game played with a lot of people. It occurred at a unique time in history that is unlikely to be replicated again. You could build the same game but players have largely moved on from this style of MMO. A shame.

Yeah UO only worked because it was basically the only game in town. The sheep were playing alongside the wolves. Once there was more choice in the market the more casually and cooperatively minded players self-selected into games catered to them. Everyone who wants 'the next UO' has got to realise it's never going to happen.

> Yeah UO only worked because it was basically the only game in town.

As someone who was deeply involved with UO for a number of years, this explains a lot of it I think.

Once there was a choice of optional PvP in UO itself the players OVERWHELMINGLY voted against non-consent PvP by fleeing to Trammel.

That said, even after Renaissance the game and community itself was still in good shape before they caught the WoW bug and destroyed what they built trying to capture that audience.

Re: We Burned Down Players’ Houses in Ultima Online

#43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

also known as database

The article strictly points out the need for a shared concurrency models required in the functioning of a online game thats massively parrelled across both clients and various individual 'servers'. Unique, hash based, 'stacked' items that are non-fungible with a decentralized shared state across clients.... yes, technically that's 'Just a database' but a highly complex one. I get people hate the hype and 'uselessness…

If I understand correctly this can be solved with much less complexity via something like snowflake to guarantee ordering consistency. There are of course dozens of ways to achieve consistency across nodes, and a blockchain is one such solution. The reality is if blockchain were an optimal distributed store it would be used for that purpose in more places. Instead what we have is a bunch of buzzword shoehorning (which frankly today sounds a bit overplayed/stale).

Re: We Burned Down Players’ Houses in Ultima Online

#44

Aside from being an amazing story, my other takes are the following: C / C++ are truly powerful and efficient languages for execution. Can you imagine doing this with Java or C# and still keeping the memory usage and speed reasonable, even in 2022? This is the late 90s (maybe early 2000s). C++ is a workhorse, warts and all. Game development is just so different from all other types of development, but I feel like if…

I'm a former game dev, I worked in PHP on the server side of our game and honestly - C++ is mostly just the dominant language because everyone is constantly overworked and everything has always been done in C++. Java and C# are some counter examples you offered which, if done right, should rival the performance you can get in C++ pretty trivially - Java may have a larger memory footprint for some things (it's harder to sanely get down to the bare metal within some contexts) but it's still quite fast. I honestly think that sometime soon we'll probably see Rust shoulder C++ out for game development once someone (eyes Epic) writes an engine with native language hooks in it simply because you get pretty much all of the performance characteristics along with one of the most valuable things in the world - extensive and resilient static code evaluation.

You can make things efficient in a plethora of different languages depending on the setting (PHP, similar to how I used it, is often chosen because it's extremely readable, flexible and all the expensive performance stuff you're doing is usually in SQL on the server-side anyways) but there are definitely certain languages that are better suited to some tasks. I would really suggest not focusing in on language choice that much though, since there are much more important decisions to make when discussing high performance architecture and having access to pointer arithmetic is, at this point, honestly more of a curse (since you have to deal with horribly unmaintainable crap in some library you need) than a benefit. Over a decade ago I had my first C++ job which used the Qt framework and using references by default (which Qt strong encourages but doesn't force) is simply a much more sane approach to development.

Re: We Burned Down Players’ Houses in Ultima Online

#45

Aside from being an amazing story, my other takes are the following: C / C++ are truly powerful and efficient languages for execution. Can you imagine doing this with Java or C# and still keeping the memory usage and speed reasonable, even in 2022? This is the late 90s (maybe early 2000s). C++ is a workhorse, warts and all. Game development is just so different from all other types of development, but I feel like if…

The main server emulator for UO, RunUO (and ServUO that spun out of it), is written in C# and runs worlds that are as large as UO had in its heyday.

A few of the very hot code paths in the netcode and elsewhere drop to unsafe to do pointer math and faster array walking but the vast majority of it is in managed space.

Re: We Burned Down Players’ Houses in Ultima Online

#46
This is pretty specific but does anyone remember in one of the Runescape open betas back in the day there was a duping bug? I think involving a chest?

If I recall it was really easy to do and by the end of the beta like everyone had totally jacked up gear

Of course it all got reset eventually since it was just a beta but I recall it being pretty hilarious to play during that period

Re: We Burned Down Players’ Houses in Ultima Online

#47
I hope anyone who enjoyed the article will find time to listen to the original team discuss UO’s early development and the crazy design and social problems they were trying to solve.

They succeeded at some, spectacularly failed at others, but brought forward things that still impact MMO and (now) Metaverse design today.

https://www.gdcvault.com/play/1024930/Classic-Game-Postmorte...

Re: We Burned Down Players’ Houses in Ultima Online

#48

I missed UO's hayday, but when I've played the big modern MMOs I find myself instead attracted to the idea that individual characters shouldn't be able to do everything. I feel like forcing players to interact if they want to gather specific resources or craft vital items would really help a game feel "massively multiplayer". Are there any modern MMOs with mechanics like this, e.g. life-skill limits or some other sou…

> Are there any modern MMOs with mechanics like this, e.g. life-skill limits or some other source of dependence on other players? I think Eve Online is the classic example. It's not technically true that players are limited in the sense that you mean. Rather, the limits are emergent. The areas with the most valuable resources also have the least game provided security, so players are forced to band together into larg…

In addition, in Eve nearly all items (ships, modules, ammo, even starbases) are player-manufactured, player-hauled, and player-sold.

Re: We Burned Down Players’ Houses in Ultima Online

#49

I missed UO's hayday, but when I've played the big modern MMOs I find myself instead attracted to the idea that individual characters shouldn't be able to do everything. I feel like forcing players to interact if they want to gather specific resources or craft vital items would really help a game feel "massively multiplayer". Are there any modern MMOs with mechanics like this, e.g. life-skill limits or some other sou…

> forcing players to interact if they want to gather specific resources or craft vital items

"sup, u gm angler?/" https://web.archive.org/web/20030731200633/http://spla.sh/bp...

Re: We Burned Down Players’ Houses in Ultima Online

#50

Gosh I remember beta testing this game, was a coming of age time, the first MMORPG. Glorious times of guilds and true PvP (e.g. you leave the town you basically were on your own) these were the true days of high online adventure!

Same era - but I had a "cheat mode" ;; We ran the Intel DRG and ran this on a bank of Intels highest end machines on a T3 to our gaming lab, just when 56K got released... and were able to effecitvely MASS PK players with 6 accounts with 100 sneak, two rogues, 2 dread lords and two great lords.... we would taunt with our dreads, run, hide, and appear with our great lords of same name and get attacked ruining the reputation of others, allowing them to kill us but specifically die next to our hidden sneaks who would loot us... and run our bullshit back to our castle.

We had a 7th castle butler account who all he would do was manage keys...

our third member of our guild got wasted one night and managed to lose our rune stones... but we had a teleport mech where we had the courtyard covered in bags of wheat? and in order to tele to the courtyard, you had to have the butler acct go pick up the bag to the tele spot such that you could zap in...

Then, our guy, Draygor,,, he accidentally got whacked with the rune stone before he could make it to the bank, and the Japanese Guild spent MONTHS waiting for us to fuckup with an account that allowed them to portal into our castle... then they fn hid until we showed up...

We used to teleport dragons onto the roof such that we could trap them behind chests and practice our spells until we had 100 in every skill ...

but we went to vacation, DRAYGOR (largest pot grower in BC Canada) who had a T1 to his house

We also had a bugged weapon that was an axe/or/hammer cant recall -- but it was one-hit-one kill no matter what.

We were actually followed for a while with that bugged weapon as we would trade it back and forth... and chased by invisible mods... (they basically have a super account that their sprite was invisible and they would follow us around....

That aside from the hitman series - is my golden games.

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