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UK Has ‘No Chance in Hell’ of Making Its Own Tech Champs: ARM Founder

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Re: UK Has ‘No Chance in Hell’ of Making Its Own Tech Champs: ARM Founder

#91

Post by registeredcorn »

ethbr0 wrote: post #87
registeredcorn wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm in the same boat as you. I'm not sure exactly what, "whether they have all the critical technologies needed to run a country and its economy", means. When I think "critical technologies" I think of a lot of what SilverBirch was bringing up. When I think of, critical technologies [...] to run a country and its economy , I think of things like: EMS, traffic lights, the stock market, electricity, etc. Similarly, say…

I think you're reasoning about it from the wrong end. The implied precursor I took from the article was that another nation suddenly decides to remove access to a critical technology, via coercing or ordering the company supplying that technology. "Technological sovereignty," in the context of the article and quotes, would mean a country has the means to continue without that access. This doesn't mean creating a comm…

Ah, that makes sense. Thanks for that!

I was coming at it from a, "Let's isolate ourselves!" type thing.

Re: UK Has ‘No Chance in Hell’ of Making Its Own Tech Champs: ARM Founder

#92

Post by FredPret »

t43562 wrote: post #37
FredPret wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

China sends a pile of money to Africa. But there is a growing disillusionment with their investments. For example, they would promise to develop infrastructure in exchange for mineral rights. So they move in a large number of Chinese, creating zero local jobs. Then they mine out the resources as fast as possible and move out. And right after that, the infrastructure invariably falls apart. They can only screw so many…

Zimbabwean here: our elite will take money from whoever will give it and make nice noises and when the time comes to pay it back in some way that involves and actual cost to themselves..........will find the next donor. The Chinese (and any other country) will only get out of Africa that which they can demand today quid-pro-quo. There won't be any loyalty.

100% the pattern I saw in other countries too; Mozambique, South Africa. No reason to expect a different trend further north

Re: UK Has ‘No Chance in Hell’ of Making Its Own Tech Champs: ARM Founder

#93

Post by denton-scratch »

Etheryte wrote: post #24
SilverBirch wrote: post #4

It sounds to me like he doesn't actually say that. In the article: >The UK has “no chance in hell” of becoming technologically sovereign Well which is it, having our own Tech champs or being technologically sovereign? Because they're totally different things. To be honest I'm not sure any country apart from China stands any chance of becoming technologically sovereign. Like what does that mean? Do we need to mine our…

This is not how the article approached technologically sovereign at all, as is this is just a strawman argument. No one proposed that sovereignty is about producing everything from scratch yourself. Here's the actual excerpt: > One question countries have to ask themselves if whether they have all the critical technologies needed to run a country and its economy. > “The answer for Britain” is “absolutely no, there is…

I hit a paywall. http://archive.today/U6BUV

> [...] whether they have all the critical technologies needed to run a country and its economy.

That's what he seems to mean by "technologically sovereign": apparently, it comes down to being able to build computers from sand and copper ore. Well, if you define "sovereign" that way, then of course the UK can never be sovereign. Napoleon called us a nation of shopkeepers; we've been dependent on trade for 400 years.

Maybe he's just having a go at the new Tory leadership, which has some odd notions about being completely independent of any one else on principle. But if that's it, it doesn't come across in the article.

Re: UK Has ‘No Chance in Hell’ of Making Its Own Tech Champs: ARM Founder

#94

Post by [deleted] »

origin_path wrote: post #62
Jweb_Guru wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am neutral on the position of UK "technological sovereignty" but I don't think listing a bunch of people who died before 1900 really helps demonstrate your point.

Alan Turing didn't die before 1900. Agree he isn't exactly relevant to the question of a modern tech sector, but these examples are at least interesting for what they show isn't the problem. A comment above AtomicOrbital's argues it's to do with a "deferential, hierarchical society" and that "bureaucracy is great for running an empire". That clearly can't be the case, given that Britain churned out computing pioneers…

[deleted]

Re: UK Has ‘No Chance in Hell’ of Making Its Own Tech Champs: ARM Founder

#95

Post by hosh »

smcl wrote: post #68
foobarian wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> 7. China needs to secure a supply of crude oil Wonder how that's coming along. I'm sure those African countries will stand up for China even when they can't get any oil.

Would Russia not be a more natural source of this? I know they're not exactly best pals but China is maybe one of the closer countries to Russia outside of Belarus and Syria rn.

Oil and other trade between Russia and China has increased since sanctions against the Russian invasion of Ukraine.

Re: UK Has ‘No Chance in Hell’ of Making Its Own Tech Champs: ARM Founder

#96

Post by 411111111111111 »

bobthepanda wrote: post #57
registeredcorn wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm in the same boat as you. I'm not sure exactly what, "whether they have all the critical technologies needed to run a country and its economy", means. When I think "critical technologies" I think of a lot of what SilverBirch was bringing up. When I think of, critical technologies [...] to run a country and its economy , I think of things like: EMS, traffic lights, the stock market, electricity, etc. Similarly, say…

Yeah, even something “simple” like a replacement of Visa or Mastercard is quite complicated.

That's not how these two credit card networks work.

You have card issuers and acquirers, both of these can be local, so it's not a big issue if you're cut off from the world.

It's more like a web of trust peer-to-peer protocol, so if a foreign entity removes you from the web of trust, you'll still be able to have transactions with anyone that still considers you trustworthy.

That's probably the only reason why visa/Mastercard is so broadly accepted.

Amex is run differently, and it's rarely accepted outside of the USA for example

Re: UK Has ‘No Chance in Hell’ of Making Its Own Tech Champs: ARM Founder

#97

Post by origin_path »

ClumsyPilot wrote: post #75
origin_path wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Alan Turing didn't die before 1900. Agree he isn't exactly relevant to the question of a modern tech sector, but these examples are at least interesting for what they show isn't the problem. A comment above AtomicOrbital's argues it's to do with a "deferential, hierarchical society" and that "bureaucracy is great for running an empire". That clearly can't be the case, given that Britain churned out computing pioneers…

> banning non-competes Are non-conpetes a violation of free market because they stop employees moving freely to a better job? Or are they free market in action, becauae thats what employer and employee negotiated? To the best of my knowledge non-conpetes are illegal in most of europe.

Good question but I'd say the former. One can imagine all sorts of 'negotiations' that restrict civilized competition which people feel forced to agree to in the moment. A free market is one in which sellers are free to compete, and buyers are free to buy. That does require various kinds of trust-busting.

Re: UK Has ‘No Chance in Hell’ of Making Its Own Tech Champs: ARM Founder

#98

Post by scyzoryk_xyz »

t43562 wrote: post #44

Well, the nerds aren't the super rich here. It's still about public schools and old money and people who studied law or the classics or at least graduated from Oxbridge. The big money in software is all from the world of finance and there's nothing tech about them - no heart or vision except how to make a faster trade. So who will foster a company that's not going to make money for 10 years? I think there's also an a…

I just interviewed at Ocado and I agree that it looks like they have it together. But then they’re outsourcing a chunk of the software to my country so not sure if that reflects well on the UK.

Another one worth mentioning a bit closer to my field is CMR - a surgical robotics company. They’re blowing enormous capital trying to conquer Europe and it might be working. Their tech is convincing and they have good showmanship. If it works out that’s an enormous market.

But it’s not visionary - just building on many incremental improvements and respectful of the thorough research and validation required. My external (optimistic) view is that this is something that is given a bit more respect in UK culture. Something about strong educational institutions and empirical reasoned thinking. But then maybe it’s just my POV?

Re: UK Has ‘No Chance in Hell’ of Making Its Own Tech Champs: ARM Founder

#99

Post by Zigurd »

prottog wrote: post #80
Zigurd wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

TBF China hasn't got a lot of choice. They do not have a highly effective vaccine. Millions of people in China would die if COVID were allowed to spread. Damned if you do, damned if you don't.

I'm not advocating that millions of people die in a vacuum, but millions of people risking death so that the other billion people in China could live a normal life is at least worth considering the trade-off. The median age of a Covid death in the US, with its obese and unhealthy population, is around the average life expectancy with some room for error. I can't imagine that China fares worse in that regard.

The Chinese government would likely consider letting COVID rip through the population if they could survive the consequences of an overwhelmed health system and the numbers of dead.

Re: UK Has ‘No Chance in Hell’ of Making Its Own Tech Champs: ARM Founder

#100

Post by smcl »

Zigurd wrote: post #99
prottog wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not advocating that millions of people die in a vacuum, but millions of people risking death so that the other billion people in China could live a normal life is at least worth considering the trade-off. The median age of a Covid death in the US, with its obese and unhealthy population, is around the average life expectancy with some room for error. I can't imagine that China fares worse in that regard.

The Chinese government would likely consider letting COVID rip through the population if they could survive the consequences of an overwhelmed health system and the numbers of dead.

So that's what is surprising to me, because I figured the CCP had a fairly tight grip on power and is in no danger of being overthrown. My naive guess as an outsider was that it's face-saving for those at the very top - to make an about-turn now would be embarrassing and an admission of defeat. And that only a few specific heads that would roll, but the government itself would remain largely intact
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