If you're reading the news, and wondering why russia might blow up the gas pipeline they own, Telegraph has a pretty decent discussion on the matter[0]. [0] https://www.telegraph.co.uk/world-news/2022/09/27/putins-nor...
Paywalled...
Gas Leak in the Baltic Sea
701–710 of 1001 posts
Re: Gas Leak in the Baltic Sea
#702Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Edit: these things are censored in google, Wikipedia etc by US state actors. We largely have to go on the words of people like Max Blumenthal and others who have been largely censored and scrubbed from easy access by these same state apparatuses or wait until foia requests reveal what they always reveal about our benevolent state. Max Blumenthal is a Russian propagandist who is a regular guest on Russian state back…
I’m sure he takes the appearances he can get after having all his sources of funding cut. I hope you’re being paid well to call people propagandists who have devoted their lives and sacrificed everything to speak truth to power. I don’t take it at face value and it does seem he has an understandable bias at this point. The gray zone is super strange to read, but these are investigative journalists on the ground. Plea…
This has gotta be satire
> Labeling people propagandists and conspiracy theorists is a new form of censorship and it is terrifying.
Literally you in a sibling comment:
> Just looked at your comment history and every comment is anti Russia. Seems you are in fact well paid.
Re: Gas Leak in the Baltic Sea
#703The shilling is immense on this one. The botfarms must be working overtime tonight.
The fact that I am getting downvoted proves this.
Re: Gas Leak in the Baltic Sea
#704Earlier quoted context omitted.
Yeah, like they have much to gain in Ukraine either. It's not like they are a rational actor at this stage.
Except maybe the Russian speaking ethnically Russian separatists in the Donbass region of Ukraine? (from before the 2022 propaganda started): https://www.dw.com/en/ukraine-the-forgotten-victims-of-donba... Story from 2018: https://www.kyivpost.com/ukraine-politics/about-40000-ukrain... So many seem to have just swallowed anything and everything the US propaganda has put out this year and know absolutely nothing about…
Your links are highly disingenuous. Russia supported armed separatists and started a low-grade war against Ukraine in 2014. Their aims have always been clear: control Crimea and seize control of a land bridge to it. They never hid these intentions, and you'd have to purposefully ignore this realpolitik in order to lay the blame at Ukraine's feet.
Are Ukrainians all saints, souls pure as the driven snow? Clearly not. Certainly not significantly better (or worse) than Russians. Similar people, similar politics, similar ethics. Their country is just as corrupt, if not more so. Their politics is just as dirty. They have their right-wing white nationalists the same as Russia. They killed people in the Donbass for a decade, yes.
But who invaded in 2014? Russia.
Who invaded in 2022? Russia.
Your argument is a lot like saying that the police in Iran are killing women "for a reason".
Re: Gas Leak in the Baltic Sea
#705Earlier quoted context omitted.
It's really not that absurd. The fact that it looks entirely irrational for Russia to do this is exactly why they might have done it. Their intent is to cause division in the West. They could potentially hope for EU countries to blame the US or Ukraine for this. If you read Twitter trends you already see an army of Russian bots pushing the theory that the US has done this.
It's not just Russian bots, unless I've been deepfaked, Biden announced he would do this if Russia invaded Ukraine prior to the Feb invasion.
Biden most certainly did not announce he would do _this_.
Re: Gas Leak in the Baltic Sea
#706Earlier quoted context omitted.
One reason for Russia to sabotage it is as a show of force. "If we can hit our pipeline we can hit your pipeline, too". In unrelated news a brand new pipeline going from Norway to Poland through the Baltic sea opened just yesterday https://www.euronews.com/2022/09/27/baltic-pipe-norway-polan... Talking about poor maintenance in a thread about registered underwater explosions sounds like FUD
Another reason would be to disincentivize another faction from deposing Putin. No secret that oligarchs have been dying left and right. Putin could have done this to remove the appeal of replacing him and going back to pre-war "normal" if they can't resume selling gas.
Bingo. This is the only one that actually makes sense to me.
Re: Gas Leak in the Baltic Sea
#707Earlier quoted context omitted.
Ukraine has a sea coast and a Navy, so I have no doubt that they have combat divers. Thus the only issue would be a logistic one. My take is that it is trivial to send people to the Baltic along with access to diving equipment and boats. Via sea route it should also be very doable to ship explosives. So it is at least plausible.
Any sort of underwater demolitions is pretty much the opposite of "trivial". How much diving have you done? The real world isn't like a James Bond movie.
It's still possible enough for a nation that splintered off a previous world superpower. It's not like Soviet combat divers and their expertise just up and disappeared once the union dissolved in the 90s
Re: Gas Leak in the Baltic Sea
#708Earlier quoted context omitted.
So, why are the politicians telling people not to heat their houses above 19°C, to wear sweaters at home, to limit showers to a few minutes and why are eg. steel mills already shutting down in germany?
Yeah, if a country doesn't have enough gas to keep everyone's house at a comfy 35C, that's like basically the same as everyone freezing to death
There's a difference between 35°C in your home, and shutting down industry and telling people not to shower.
Re: Gas Leak in the Baltic Sea
#709Earlier quoted context omitted.
> A very hard winter is predicted If you are implying that weather forecast is accurate months ahead - nobody knows what the temperatures will be this winter. Everything further ahead than 7 days is pretty much rolling the dice. https://scijinks.gov/forecast-reliability/
> If you are implying that weather forecast is accurate months ahead Nop. Hard as in a winter full of hardship, stress and problems. > Everything further ahead than 7 days is pretty much rolling the dice. And yet every winter it is cold here and every summer it is hot. Nobody can say which day will be sunny and which day will be stormy that far ahead, but clearly there are trends. Cold combined with high energy price…
Winter in Europe has huge variations in severity. The difference between a cold and a mild winter can make an annual 15% difference in gas consumption in Germany, for example [1]. The difference between running out of gas and not running out of gas falls right between those two weather scenarios.
Winter being generally colder than summer - that's climate, which is different from weather.
[1] https://www.focus.de/finanzen/boerse/konjunktur/studie-skizz...
Re: Gas Leak in the Baltic Sea
#710Earlier quoted context omitted.
I’m sure he takes the appearances he can get after having all his sources of funding cut. I hope you’re being paid well to call people propagandists who have devoted their lives and sacrificed everything to speak truth to power. I don’t take it at face value and it does seem he has an understandable bias at this point. The gray zone is super strange to read, but these are investigative journalists on the ground. Plea…
This has gotta be satire > Labeling people propagandists and conspiracy theorists is a new form of censorship and it is terrifying. Literally you in a sibling comment: > Just looked at your comment history and every comment is anti Russia. Seems you are in fact well paid.
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