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America’s Open Wound

edwardsnowden.substack.com

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Re: America’s Open Wound

#241

Post by NaturalPhallacy »

HideousKojima wrote: post #23
pavlov wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Russia is basically a country that was taken over by a rogue intelligence agency. Putin is a KGB man through and through. Ironic that Snowden found his sanctuary there. He's presumably a Russian citizen now — at least he applied for citizenship in November 2020.

>Ironic that Snowden found his sanctuary there. It wasn't really by choice, as I understand it he was trying to relocate to South America. And given events like grounding the plane of a head of state because they suspected Snowden was on board I can't say I'm surprised he hasn't tried to relocate to elsewhere.

The US state department revoked his passport while he was in Russia.

The American govt trapped him there.

Re: America’s Open Wound

#243

Post by somenameforme »

AdamH12113 wrote: post #91
rendall wrote: post #2

Did any American read this without alarm? If so, why not?

The CIA being a nasty organization that does nasty things has been well-known for decades. What makes (most) Americans tolerate this is the same reason anyone tolerates such nasty things -- they're being done to other people. Drone strikes in particular have been discussed since the Obama administration. It's not okay, but as Snowden himself points out, it is normal. What did alarm me was Snowden mischaracterizing Bi…

As Biden gets into his speech, and for about 98% of the video - the framing is exactly as Snowden presented. Given politicians are the sort of people that obsess over the implications of the color of a tie, this visual was chosen absolutely intentionally: a flag hung vertically, blood red imposed on a dark scene, and two shadowy marines in the rear. I have no idea why they went for this visual, but it's difficult to attribute it to any motivation that is at all desirable.

Incidentally, if you originally watched the video on CNN, I'd encourage you to check out your own link, past the 40 second mark! Because that leads to a much more light hearted (though not really, if you really think about the implications of this) issue. As this video was streamed CNN distorted the colors, in real time, to try to increase the apparent lighting while also turning the crimson red into something like a fuchsia pink. [1] If you think that link might itself be fake, feel free to just look at any of CNN's coverage [2] and compare it against the source videos.

Everybody understood exactly the sort of imagery Biden's writers were looking to evoke. The only question that remains to be answered is why.

[1] - https://twitter.com/burackbobby_/status/1565543514137677824

[2] - https://edition.cnn.com/videos/politics/2022/09/02/veteran-r...

Re: America’s Open Wound

#244

Post by ticviking »

strictnein wrote: post #202
ssnistfajen wrote: post #154

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or perhaps we don't need HN exceptionalism? Intelligence isn't translated universally onto all subject matters. Just because someone is good at writing code doesn't make them well-suited to understand any non-programming topics to have a well-informed or rational discussion about it. There's no reason why HN should have a higher quality discussion on these subjects than some generic subreddit or FB comment sections.…

This. Also, it applies to Snowden, who at his best is a glorified Sharepoint admin. He has no special insight into any other aspect of existence.

Who had the courage to speak up about our governments vast overreach and illegal domestic surveillance program. His exceptional courage is why we might pay special attention to his opinion, even when we disagree with it or suspect it's influenced by who has granted him asylum.

Re: America’s Open Wound

#246

Post by jononomo »

blub wrote: post #94
jnovek wrote: post #87

Has everyone on Hacker News lost their minds? I come here to read and sometimes participate in rational discussions. These comments are some of the lowest effort, least rigorous, paranoid bullshit I’ve ever seen on this site. We’re a step above Facebook comments on NPR articles, here. Partisanship, viciousness and lazy conspiracy theories are not a good look for this site.

Yes, the amount of hate for Snowden and Assange is dismaying. These men sacrificed their lives to expose the crimes of one of - if not the most -powerful organizations on Earth. And people nitpick that they’re not criticizing the other most powerful entities too. Basically they’re criticizing them for not committing suicide in the name of a people which were impotent of unwilling to do anything with the revelations p…

No post body was provided.

Re: America’s Open Wound

#247

Post by _jal »

knodi123 wrote: post #206
_jal wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> if the US dropped charges Well, I guess he's just trapped by the practical problems created by his peculiar combination of personal morality and cowardice. If you claim whistle-blowing is justified by the exposed crimes and then run, whoever owns wherever you end up now owns you. If they happen to be worse... eh, you made your choice, now live with it. He made his choice.

We shouldn't listen to any whistleblower unless they are willing to martyr themselves? That seems like an unfair standard.

Don't put words in my mouth. I listen to everything he says, there's a lot to learn. And nowhere am I suggesting he martyr himself.

Here's a hint, if you're having difficulty: I'm mostly just describing his plight. I'm not approving of the NSA, FBI, Russia, or anyone else. I do admire him in many respects.

I'm just not terribly sympathetic. For as much time as he spent on the immediate escape, it seems like he spent none on, "...and then what?" Kind of an important detail for an aspiring man of international mystery. Instead, he's turned himself into Putin's tchotchke, sitting on a shelf unless and until he somehow becomes situationally useful.

Re: America’s Open Wound

#248

Post by [deleted] »

jononomo wrote: post #246
blub wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, the amount of hate for Snowden and Assange is dismaying. These men sacrificed their lives to expose the crimes of one of - if not the most -powerful organizations on Earth. And people nitpick that they’re not criticizing the other most powerful entities too. Basically they’re criticizing them for not committing suicide in the name of a people which were impotent of unwilling to do anything with the revelations p…

Quoted post unavailable.

[deleted]

Re: America’s Open Wound

#249

Post by ssnistfajen »

CodeMage wrote: post #178
ssnistfajen wrote: post #154

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or perhaps we don't need HN exceptionalism? Intelligence isn't translated universally onto all subject matters. Just because someone is good at writing code doesn't make them well-suited to understand any non-programming topics to have a well-informed or rational discussion about it. There's no reason why HN should have a higher quality discussion on these subjects than some generic subreddit or FB comment sections.…

> Or perhaps we don't need HN exceptionalism? It's not exceptionalism to lament the downfall of the tradition of carefully cultivated discourse. I still remember when this community used to be different, and this site was the one I went to first. > There's no reason why HN should have a higher quality discussion than some generic subreddit or FB comment sections. Yes, there is. HN uses to have a higher quality discus…

Carefully cultivated discourse is still abundant on HN, which is why I read this site regularly. They just aren't usually found under threads that touch non-strictly tech things like geopolitics, history, natural sciences, or lifestyle. Although I do agree the moderation needs to be more responsive in some of these situations, I have made peace with the fact that HN doesn't have 100% high quality discussion.

Re: America’s Open Wound

#250

Post by angrycontrarian »

NaturalPhallacy wrote: post #242
angrycontrarian wrote: post #201

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quoted post unavailable.

Quoted post unavailable.

There absolutely are, but in his Philadelphia speech, Biden equated anyone who supports his leading opponent(s) in 2024, with being a domestic terrorist.
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