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US border forces are seizing Americans' phone data and storing it for 15 years

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Re: US border forces are seizing Americans' phone data and storing it for 15 years

#101

Post by oneplane »

xoa wrote: post #81
oneplane wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That sounds great when typing it up on the internet in a comfortable chair, but when a few power hungry workers with guns are breathing down your neck in a small room you can't get out of, the rules aren't going to make you feel 'safe'.

As sibling comments have said already, rights must be defended, and clear eyed prep is a big part of the answer for individuals. Even just thinking it through a bit, while you have time. > That sounds great How does having your property confiscated for days/weeks and being arrested sound "great" to you? It's not great, it stinks. For some people it could even be ruinous. But it's also legal reality. Every single "rig…

Not everyone wants to spend their time on any of this. Some people want to go about their day as they please without having to deal with any of this. That's the entire goal of having a society.

Re: US border forces are seizing Americans' phone data and storing it for 15 years

#102

Post by hackerlight »

koheripbal wrote: post #42
johndfsgdgdfg wrote: post #3

The way US treats the migrants is human rights violation at the border. Now add this to the pile of atrocities committed by the border patrol and ICE. It's high time we should consider open border.

This is like suggesting a biological cell not have a cell wall. One of the fundamental functions of a country is to regulate input/outputs at the border. There are so many disastrous problems that arise from the elimination of a border, that I question whether such a suggestion is ever even made seriously or made by sane people.

I advocate for almost completely open borders, for three reasons, freedom + economic growth + national security.

(1) Freedom. Closed borders was actually one of the first iterations of technology being used to suppress human freedom. We had open borders for most of human history. Only with the advent of modern nation states (and the associated mind virus of nationalism) and recent technical capabilities have we both been motivated and capable of blocking people from travelling and moving freely.

(2) Economic growth. Self-explanatory. Look at where our top founders, or their recent ancestors, come from. The more immigration, the better.

(3) In the long-run steady state, geopolitical power comes from population size. China and India surpassing the US economically and militarily is a near inevitability and a matter of time. I'd rather a liberal democracy play the role of world police than an authoritarian regime. But that's only possible with 600 million+ Americans.

TLDR, closed borders is a disgusting modern aberration with racist and protectionist motivations that stunts the growth of countries and eliminates the freedoms of humans.

Re: US border forces are seizing Americans' phone data and storing it for 15 years

#103

Post by cguess »

dhruval wrote: post #63
howmayiannoyyou wrote: post #39

Terrifying for only 2 reasons: 1. Any malicious person savvy enough to pull off a crime of interest to the Feds is smart enough to provide a wiped or burner phone to DHS/ICE, and they have to know this. So, what is the point in doing this if not to target law abiding citizens. 2. USGOV has a spotty track record of keeping this information secure. A foreign actor is likely to access this info eventually. As one former…

I just just reading this Bloomberg story about a Chinese spy who was busted. It’s mind boggling how sloppy even state backed malicious agents are at information security. https://www.bloomberg.com/news/newsletters/2022-09-16/chines...

It's hard to keep up security. You get tired, lonely, bored, exhausted. Everyone screws up at some point, you hope that those you're hiding from don't notice.

It's similar to torture training in the US Military: they teach you that everyone breaks eventually, the trick is to hold out long enough the information you provide isn't that useful anymore.

Re: US border forces are seizing Americans' phone data and storing it for 15 years

#104

Post by makeworld »

mlindner wrote: post #83
jliptzin wrote: post #45

This happened to me in 2016 crossing into Canada. Borders agents took my phone for no reason, demand I give them the password to unlock it (otherwise they would seize the phone), took it in the back for 45 min before returning it and letting me enter. I think it’s obvious they took all my data. So now when I travel I just bring my “travel” phone with no sensitive data on it.

They can't actually do that. If you just refuse to give them the password they'll give it back to you.

Do you have a Canadian source on this?

Re: US border forces are seizing Americans' phone data and storing it for 15 years

#105

Post by upsidesinclude »

josefresco wrote: post #54
flenserboy wrote: post #30

Treat every phone as a burner.

Pretty difficult with 2FA

It seems there is an intentional effort to drive your digital identity and financial identity/history to your mobile device.

This makes social control much less complicated

Re: US border forces are seizing Americans' phone data and storing it for 15 years

#106

Post by unethical_ban »

lazyier wrote: post #23
thesuitonym wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A government controlled by its people, instead of controlling its people, doesn't need to worry about being overthrown.

Yeah, but that defeats the purpose of creating the state in the first place. The entire point is being able to tell people what to do for your own profit. It's a lot easier if you pretend you are doing it for the subject's benefit as it reduces the resistance to rule immensely. But you don't want to let that go too far or they start getting a big head and start thinking that paying you billions of dollars is optional…

There are legitimate reasons for a State to exist.

Re: US border forces are seizing Americans' phone data and storing it for 15 years

#108

Post by N19PEDL2 »

Havoc wrote: post #76
pearjuice wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

45 minutes of unsupervised access to your phone? Even if it's a "travel" phone I wouldn't connect it to any other device after that.

What are you gonna do? Throw you new iphone in the bin?

Buy a 2nd-hand $40 scrap phone, erase it, save a few panorama pictures and a couple of selfies on it and put your SIM card in it every time you are about to cross a border. Then put the card back in your regular phone after that.

Re: US border forces are seizing Americans' phone data and storing it for 15 years

#109

Post by Bakary »

ryukafalz wrote: post #89
Bakary wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's not an acceptable answer in a number of countries.

Then what is an acceptable answer if you really have not brought your main phone?

The vast majority of flights won't include device searches or these awkward questions. But if you are in a situation where they do want to search your phone, the fact that it's a travel phone is not going to be received well. This will of course depend on the border guard in question. Unless you are a citizen of the country your capacity to enter it is now compromised because the will of the border guard is in practice nearly absolute and without recourse.
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