Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Ask HN: Have tech salaries been stagnant for the past decade?

news.ycombinator.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

161–170 of 345 posts

Re: Ask HN: Have tech salaries been stagnant for the past decade?

#161

Post by giantg2 »

lrvick wrote: post #75
IaacForHire wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have a cousin who makes $220k as a crane operator at a port. I'll never make that much in my career.

Not with that attitude. If you are healthy, have people skills, and are capable of learning new things regularly then you can generally make as much as you want in this industry.

I feel like this is toxic positivity.

People can't just make as much as they want. There's always competition and other constraining factors. It's absolutely reasonable to say that you'll never make $220k (in 2022 $) as a dev when the median is $110k, regardless of one's attitude.

Re: Ask HN: Have tech salaries been stagnant for the past decade?

#162

Post by pembrook »

2rsf wrote: post #48
IaacForHire wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oof, European salaries are absurdly low. When I first left the USA I was thinking "OK I'll get a nice job in Amsterdam or Denmark" .. Then I saw the cost of living and the low salaries, and waved away that dream.

I don't want to pen THIS discussion again, but... the difference is not that big especially if you calculate risk and family in. I live in Sweden with our "known" high taxes and as far as I can tell from conversations with friends and colleagues is that our QUALITY of life is not that different. Of course, YMMV especially if you were a big shot in a big shot place with no family to support, young and healthy.

I don't want to offer the canned rebuttal to this either, but, the free healthcare and education don't make up for a salary potential that maxes out at 2-3X lower than what you could make in the US (especially combined with much lower taxes).

The fact is, the Nordics are de-facto the best place in the world to be below average. They're not a great value if your skills offer you above-average earning potential.

Sure, your QOL might be similar while working. But in the US, you can retire by 45 on a FAANG salary (even with a family!). That's virtually impossible on the entire continent of Europe as a salaryman.

Re: Ask HN: Have tech salaries been stagnant for the past decade?

#163

Post by andsoitis »

giantg2 wrote: post #145
pid-1 wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Tech salaries are going to be on a decline for a while with the Fed rate hike Isn't that true for the whole economy?

In fact, were seeing the largest increases in pay over the past two years (and i think in real pay too), and they're forecasting that will continue this year as well. This is much more prominent in the lower paying jobs than in professional ones.

> In fact, were seeing the largest increases in pay over the past two years (and i think in real pay too), and they're forecasting that will continue this year as well.

Last two years I agree, and fueled by a acceleration of business for tech companies. But continue this year? Who is forecasting that?

Re: Ask HN: Have tech salaries been stagnant for the past decade?

#164

Post by hiq »

IaacForHire wrote: post #27
oxff wrote: post #7

In Europe they've probably gone down the past decade I'd say.

Oof, European salaries are absurdly low. When I first left the USA I was thinking "OK I'll get a nice job in Amsterdam or Denmark" .. Then I saw the cost of living and the low salaries, and waved away that dream.

> European salaries are absurdly low.

Counterexample: Zurich, Switzerland.

Re: Ask HN: Have tech salaries been stagnant for the past decade?

#165

Post by Victerius »

giantg2 wrote: post #145
pid-1 wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Tech salaries are going to be on a decline for a while with the Fed rate hike Isn't that true for the whole economy?

In fact, were seeing the largest increases in pay over the past two years (and i think in real pay too), and they're forecasting that will continue this year as well. This is much more prominent in the lower paying jobs than in professional ones.

A little mentioned dynamic is that tech salaries can't be too much out-of-sync with non-tech salaries, because overpriced housing bought up by SWEs making 300K+ eventually leads to non-SWEs demanding wage increases to keep up with rent payments and/or remain able to save for a downpayment on newly priced homes. In turn, the lower disposable income from workers being squeezed by housing costs is lowering growth and tech growth in particular, which puts pressure on tech wages, stock valuations, and headcount.

In other words, free market mechanisms are slowly starting to redistribute wealth from high-earning SWEs and other high earners to middle class workers and lower.

In other words, it is not possible for too many people to be making 5x+ the median household income regardless of the value they may create.

In other words, expect non-tech wages to rise faster than tech wages for the foreseeable future.

Re: Ask HN: Have tech salaries been stagnant for the past decade?

#166

Post by jobs_throwaway »

IaacForHire wrote: post #111
Firmwarrior wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd never say this on Reddit, Facebook, or LinkedIn, but you're hanging out in Programmer Heaven right now, for fun, in your spare time. ANYONE hanging out here CAN definitely make a fat living in the SF Bay Area. Go out there and get rich!!! The only things I want to see you complaining about are interview loops, followed by the fact that you can barely afford a house on your $300k/year total compensation

I wish I had your enthusiasm. I've been unemployed 90% of the time since Covid. Ironically, I've given at least 5 people their start in this industry who are all now worth 8 figures. There are haves and there are have nots.

And you're acting in such a way that you will always be a have not, and it will always be someone else's fault

Re: Ask HN: Have tech salaries been stagnant for the past decade?

#167

Post by ny-anon »

Going anon for this

I grew up poor, got in trouble with the law at 18 - but was coding since I was 9, now I have been writing software for 20+ years professionally, no degree, and have never been able to clear more than 250k - moved from coding to mgmt but still cant break 250. I looked at changing companies to a FAANG but haven’t been able to dedicate the massive amount of time needed to prep for the algo whiteboard / leetcode interview process (which I still don’t really understand as most of the actual work needed to be done will require 0 of this)

After taxes my take home is so low I still can’t afford to own a home here in ny.

Tried migrating to sv a few years back but it’s even more expensive than ny.

I’ve always kept my hands on skills up to date, coded large distributed systems that are in prod supporting millions of daily’s, big data pipelines capturing billions of records daily and as mgmt, onboarded and trained juniors who’ve gone on to big tech and been able to far surpass me in earnings.

Disillusioned and wondering what advice HN might suggest.

- ny anon, beard greying and hope depleting

Re: Ask HN: Have tech salaries been stagnant for the past decade?

#168

Post by revertmean »

yrgulation wrote: post #60
IaacForHire wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have a cousin who makes $220k as a crane operator at a port. I'll never make that much in my career.

A welder in london charges 700£ plus per day. A bit difficult to reach as a software engineer.

Email I got yesterday:

DevOps Engineer

City of London, London, £600 - £700/day

EDIT: Sorry, you did say Software Developer. How about this? https://www.cv-library.co.uk/job/217407072/Senior-Front-End-...

£650 - £750/day Remote

Re: Ask HN: Have tech salaries been stagnant for the past decade?

#169

Post by tdumitrescu »

IaacForHire wrote: post #51
yrgulation wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thats odd. I know loads of lawyers living in mansions while loads of “highly paid” developers live with housemates, or rent tiny homes. If anything, software development pay has reached construction worker pay. At least we dont have to sit out in the cold.

I have a cousin who makes $220k as a crane operator at a port. I'll never make that much in my career.

From your other replies here you sound a bit burned out. 220 is easily within the reach of devops people in the modern software industry, and certainly not just at the big-name tech companies. But you do have to work for _some_ kind of decently-funded company if you want it as a salary rather than doing your own thing (consulting etc).

Re: Ask HN: Have tech salaries been stagnant for the past decade?

#170

Post by 988747 »

yrgulation wrote: post #56
IaacForHire wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oof, European salaries are absurdly low. When I first left the USA I was thinking "OK I'll get a nice job in Amsterdam or Denmark" .. Then I saw the cost of living and the low salaries, and waved away that dream.

Try east europe, pays better and lower taxes. Standard of living is improving and accommodation is way better. You have room for growth as well. At least that’s what i see among software engs in Romania. Net pay is lower but take home is better. Heard poland and bulgaria arent far off. Ukraine was also good before the war.

In Poland you can make close to $100k per year (as a contractor, not employee), and only have like 18% tax rate on this (12% income tax plus social security payments). So you earn like $6-6.5k monthly after taxes, and all your living expenses are maybe $1.5k. You can save the rest towards your apartment/house (and you need $130-200k for that, or 3-5 years of saving).
Post reply on HN