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Ask HN: What are examples of companies dying due to many people quitting?

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Re: Ask HN: What are examples of companies dying due to many people quitting?

#461

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you are grossly misinformed. >when the design team of Google hiring are not made up of HR personnel, it could be construed as a violation of Federal labor law. There is nothing illegal about the design team participating in or even running the hiring process. >HR design team and hiring (non-HR) team are one and the same playing fast and loose with privilege info, many lawyers will be all over this. There is n…

That was on the advice of my lawyer. You, however, probably need to consult your legal team.

This type of discussion is typical. If all goes well, no worries, Signed Language is so beautiful, how can I learn to sign? and so on. If there are problems, Deaf people are used to rough treatment. And if they complain they are told off not to be so sensitive, that what they say is not correct, or they get the silence treatment.

It seems there is something like an impedance mismatch between Deafies and Hearies and sometimes the sparks fly furiously.

C'est la vie.

Re: Ask HN: What are examples of companies dying due to many people quitting?

#462
post #262

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think Massachusetts has similar rules these days (after long-running opposition from some major employers). However, while 50% salary definitely makes a company put skin in the game, it's not a panacea. And, from an employee point of view, how many people will be comfortable with taking 50% salary (with no benefits, bonuses, or RSUs) to hang out for a year? Sure, some younger folks might see it as an opportunity bu…

> benefits, bonuses, or RSUs "Benefits" isn't really relevant for Germany but bonuses and RSUs (though again, nobody in Germany gets those) are figured into the 50%. Pretty much everyone I know would take such a contract; programmers make 1.5x-2x median salary to begin with even in Europe, and it's "don't compete", not "don't work".

In Massachusetts at least I think it's strictly salary which could probably represent 25% or less of your total comp. And yeah, you can work but there's no guarantee you would be able to work for another vaguely related software company, for example. I know people who wanted to go off on their own as consultants and did indeed have to take a year off.

Re: Ask HN: What are examples of companies dying due to many people quitting?

#463
post #448

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe, but I can assure you from back when I tried to engage in good faith it's pretty damn accurate . It doesn't hurt that HN's a target-rich environment for such a detector, of course.

I had the feeling my honest questions were not-rarely seen as sarcasms or bad faith arguments. Probably has some overlap with autistic spectrum disorders. And I often wished I could specify “please read this comment in literally the way I wrote it and don’t try to find a non-existing message between the lines”. Alas.

> And I often wished I could specify “please read this comment in literally the way I wrote it and don’t try to find a non-existing message between the lines”. Alas.

This is definitely a problem, and while typical on the Web more broadly, there are a few flavors of it that are more common here than other places. You have my sympathy, and I do try to be aware of my own limitations and don't just run around flag-happy for anything I might be able to read as having a bad tone. Though I'm sure I mess up sometimes.

However—there's a certain kind of needling, brash posting style that's nearly always just someone trying to tee themselves up for some usually-idiotic rant or series of needlessly-aggressive arguments they have prepared but don't yet have an entry to post without being off-topic, that's often initiated with a question that looks kinda innocent but's just a little off. That's the "smell" I mean, and it's the kind I've learned to just flag without trying to "help" (due to assuming good faith), and I'm pretty sure I have a low false-positive rate on those. This is, from what I can tell, an extremely successful approach to trolling HN (I'm quite certain a few posters do it for that express purpose, though I do think the typical motive is different and not purely aimed at creating chaos and bad feelings), and one that HN has no good defense against except cleaning it up after the fact, which is often after the whole discussion thread's mostly dead, anyway.

It's not unusual for half the posts in a thread to stem from these kinds of premeditated argument-prompts that were never intended to curiously explore the problem space (though they may, for a time, masquerade as such) and to end up acrimonious and/or in massive wheel-spinning flame wars—as there's no other way it could have gone, because the instigator was looking for a fight, even if they weren't trying to troll per se, and were relying on assume-good-faith engagement to let the embers mature into a full-blown fire so they could embark on their righteous crusade or whatever it is they think they're doing, rather than being ignored (again: for god's sake, give us user ignore-lists—that and making poster identity a little more prominent so we can more easily recognize patterns, rather than instances, of behavior would help so much and I bet those flame sub-threads would get a lot quieter) or instantly called out and told to fuck off as they might on other sites that lack strong adherence to the "assume good faith" rule.

To avoid just shitting on the site (I'm not here because I hate it... though I do think some parodies and unkind criticisms of HN are closer to the truth, than its own collective self-image is), if I could pick out one cultural thing I really like about HN, it's the relative lack of value-free posts about obvious typos or accidental word omissions or that sort of thing. You see occasional corrections of actual usage or spelling mistakes, where the poster seems not to have slipped up but to actually have a poor idea of what's most-correct and to have done the wrong thing unknowingly, but on purpose, but those are usually polite and at least convey potentially-useful information. But, very little "did you mean X LOL?" where every single person reading it can tell that yes, they meant X, and simply made a mistake. That shit's really common on some other corners of the Web and it's just the worst. I think that quality's mainly a consequence of HN being pretty decent at policing blatantly low-value posts in general.

Re: Ask HN: What are examples of companies dying due to many people quitting?

#464
post #195

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sometimes they win demands even when the strike is illegal. The 2018 West Virginia teacher's strike turned into a wildcat (unauthorized) strike but that didn't stop them from winning a 5% pay raise. It does depend a lot on community support and sympathy. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2018_West_Virginia_teachers%...

Some states it's just illegal for teachers to strike at all, wildcat or not, or even to organize with unions.

A wildcat strike is always illegal in the US. Organizing a union isn't illegal in any state, it's about whether the union gets official recognition and official bargaining rights. My point was that it's possible to win even if you don't have those things.

Re: Ask HN: What are examples of companies dying due to many people quitting?

#465
post #462

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> benefits, bonuses, or RSUs "Benefits" isn't really relevant for Germany but bonuses and RSUs (though again, nobody in Germany gets those) are figured into the 50%. Pretty much everyone I know would take such a contract; programmers make 1.5x-2x median salary to begin with even in Europe, and it's "don't compete", not "don't work".

In Massachusetts at least I think it's strictly salary which could probably represent 25% or less of your total comp. And yeah, you can work but there's no guarantee you would be able to work for another vaguely related software company, for example. I know people who wanted to go off on their own as consultants and did indeed have to take a year off.

> In Massachusetts at least I think it's strictly salary which could probably represent 25% or less of your total comp.

Then for most people this holds true they're making like $100k/year and $300k/year in RSUs? "Uncomfortable" taking a year with _no work_ for "only" $50k after that? I mean, come on. If you want to top it up, flip burgers a couple days a week.

Re: Ask HN: What are examples of companies dying due to many people quitting?

#466
post #9

There was a very recent case where an emergency trauma center had to shut down because all the nurses left for another hospital for better working conditions. It’s also common in rehab centers. You can’t take Medicare patients without a minimum staff count. If too many nurses leave, patients can’t be accepted and you end up bleeding. Basically any job that primarily requires human capital.

Have a link? Alway interested in these examples.

https://www.nytimes.com/2022/01/24/us/thedacare-lawsuit-wisc...

^ is the only recent one in acute care I’ve heard of but it doesn’t really fit your other details (limited service line, multiple role groups, ambiguity around actual impact).

Re: Ask HN: What are examples of companies dying due to many people quitting?

#467

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not to mention: "Shockley became widely known for his extreme views on race and his advocacy of eugenics". Sounds like a terrible person.

The question is whether we tolerate assholes for their inventions and brilliancy? What material damage his asshole-ness has caused compared to the benefits he provided to the world? It is quite overwhelmingly clear. My take is that these are the people that herald the western civilization. The misfits, the weirdos and the, yes, assholes. They have almost zero chance to convince everyone of their twisted views of Euge…

Shockley is the exception to the 'tolerating assholes' rule, he was far enough outside the rails that he was largely shunned by his peers, subordinates, and everyone else.

Re: Ask HN: What are examples of companies dying due to many people quitting?

#468
post #234

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you go to the souce on the Wikipedia page, it tells a slightly different story than what the OP said - https://www.mcvuk.com/business-news/publishing/the-medal-of-... >Yet 2015 would never get the chance to make another Medal of Honor. EA decided to take all development for the franchise in-house. Morale was low amongst the team and they were looking to start up on its own. >We had bonded as a team, but decided we…

Yeah, I'm giving a simplified version, and also avoiding disclosing some details that might blow back on my friend. It was considerably more nasty than that article portrays via the quotes.

Except you basically said "they quit solely because of money" and the article basically says "it wasn't at all about the money."

Those are very different things. One isn't a "simplified" version of the other.

Re: Ask HN: What are examples of companies dying due to many people quitting?

#469
post #376

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah this story has a problem. An entire company 'quits' and just 're-does the thing' is almost assuredly theft of know-now and IP, but more than that theft of the operating modality. It takes in incredible amount of work, risk, investment etc. to 'get something up and going' - with all of the parts working. Any time you walk into a company you'll see what looks like 'things working' on some level, usually that took…

> It takes in incredible amount of work, risk, investment etc. to 'get something up and going' - with all of the parts working. So.. it's fair if the people who did all the hard work ask for some form of participation? If all it takes to duplicate a product is money and the people with know-how, than the capital is a rather marginal contribution? And I am deliberately talking about know-how, and not IP here. You cann…

It's fair for employees to ask, it's fair to be told know.

"You cannot apply copyright to the knowledge of your employees. "

? Absolutely you can, legally.

But the issues is just as much moral one.

The owners put it together and paid for the employees to make all sorts of mistakes etc..

It would be shameful if they did that.

All of that said I don't think that's the case.

Re: Ask HN: What are examples of companies dying due to many people quitting?

#470
post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For elderly people, sure. For younger? Not so much. It's not helping them very much. I'm not saying it's nothing, but it's not necessary to require it to work as a nurse. The worst part, of course, is the short time that it works. I've seen places where if you got vaccinated 2 years ago, you are golden. Had covid a month ago? A pariah. That is not based on good science, that's just obedience.

You are spreading lies and disinformation. > Almost All Teens in ICU With COVID Were Unvaccinated: Study https://www.webmd.com/vaccines/covid-19-vaccine/news/2022011... > Third of teens hospitalized for COVID-19 need ICU care; CDC chief urges youth to get vaccinated https://www.beckershospitalreview.com/public-health/third-of... > Throughout the periods of Delta and Omicron predominance, hospitalization rates remaine…

You are misreading that study: Only 25% (299/1222) of the children and teens in the study were vaccinated, and yet only 7 deaths over 4 months in 23 states.

The conclusion is that the vaccine can work, and yet be unnecessary. Even with 75% unvaccinated, there were barely any deaths.

Kids simply do not need the vaccine.

Pay attention to how every one of the articles you linked simply glosses over the tiny number of patients admitted to hospital. Just because something works does not mean it's necessary.

And it's quite distressing to see how any criticism of vaccine policy is labeled as "lies and disinformation". Would you like to burn a witch next?

It's OK for someone to disagree with you, without you accusing them of lying.

And as I have found typical in these types of debates is the completely blind spot toward natural immunity. For some reason vaccine "pushers" seem to ignore that it even exists.

Tell me: Who is better protected, someone who was fully vaccinated 2 years ago, or someone who never was vaccinated, but recovered from covid 1 month ago?

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