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Porsche boss faces software woes keeping VW a step behind Tesla

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Re: Porsche boss faces software woes keeping VW a step behind Tesla

#231

Post by TMWNN »

redox99 wrote: post #215
xyzzy_plugh wrote: post #136

This is funny to me, in a perhaps sad way. I've interviewed quite a few Tesla software engineers and worked with several ex-Tesla software engineers in various capacities. The impression I have is that Tesla software is fucking terrible , generally. I'm sure there are some smart folks there and I don't mean to disparage anyone working there but, the stuff I've seen or heard is enough that I would never purchase one o…

I don't know what software you are referring to. But with the IVI, which is what users interact with, the difference is night and day. Most cars have shitty, laggy IVI that will get no meaningful updates. You are on many cases almost forced to use Apple/Android Car. Teslas give you more of an Apple treatment. You will receive meaningful updates for years. It is mostly fluid and good looking. It is exciting for the pe…

>Teslas give you more of an Apple treatment. You will receive meaningful updates for years.

What is the cutoff for Tesla cars receiving software updates? Are the early models no longer supported?

Re: Porsche boss faces software woes keeping VW a step behind Tesla

#232

Post by [deleted] »

leobg wrote: post #189
tsunamifury wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, but what they didn’t say in that statement is they were attempting to correct the issue post-incident to cover their tracks before the owners got together and gave testimony. They kept telling drivers it was a one off issue that no one had experienced, while in reality many had been affected. They even offered significant payoffs to some. It was well past negligence and into active harm. When advised cars were b…

Somebody else here in another thread said that the Germans seem to be a gullible people, and that if he was German, he would be running all kinds of scams. Well, this is exactly what seems to be happening in many places that, from the outside, look like German success stories. They scam, manipulate and take shortcuts. That’s the shadow of gullibility. On the one hand, you do what you are told and look up to authority…

[deleted]

Re: Porsche boss faces software woes keeping VW a step behind Tesla

#233

Post by himinlomax »

fdsfdsafdsafd wrote: post #31
geodel wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People should try to reconcile the facts that those outrageously high FAANG salaries occurs because of 1) Near monopoly in that sector 2) Excessive surveillance and tracking users 3) Increasing inequality between haves and have nots. And non-FAANG type IT worker are also paid relatively high at the cost of other workers living perilous lives. So unless Europeans really start cherishing these "values". They are not go…

Your post has a misunderstanding of basic economics. The high salaries of FAANG are not at "the cost of everyone else"

Indeed, it's just typical zero sum bias.

Re: Porsche boss faces software woes keeping VW a step behind Tesla

#234

Post by jfim »

MrBuddyCasino wrote: post #196
rad_gruchalski wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t understand your question. What do you mean by “but free”?

Lack of market forces leading to mediocrity I suppose?

Or lack of a profit motive leading to not trying to game metrics as much. If an entity is ranked by some metric, and the better they are that metric, the more profitable they are, then they have an incentive to game it as much as possible.

Re: Porsche boss faces software woes keeping VW a step behind Tesla

#235

Post by petre »

i80and wrote: post #60
orangepurple wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

New Dacia cars fit the bill and they use modern Renault drivetrains under license. Funnily they get poor safety ratings because they don't include many electronic driving aids (lol) Their structural safety is great.

Calling their structural safety great seems like an overstatement -- I can't find a Dacia model on EuroNCAP that doesn't have sketchy dummy kinematics, and one new model (Spring) performs startlingly poorly in crash tests The best appears to be the 2021 Dacia Logan[1] which has a crash test littered with "marginals": > [...] structures in the dashboard presented a risk of injury to occupants of different sizes and to…

Dacia Spring is actually a Chinese car. It's called Dongfeng Spring and is available on Alibaba.

Dacia makes cheap cars. They're okay but they drive like a cart, the chairs are crappy and the clutch pedal is quite annoying in how it feels.

Re: Porsche boss faces software woes keeping VW a step behind Tesla

#236

Post by Gravityloss »

rad_gruchalski wrote: post #98
gumby wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is the model for the tron/itron os in Japan. Most devices you buy from Japan run itron.

Yeah, I still cannot get over that answer. I mean, Fraunhofer is a major German research org and it should be in their business to promote such solutions. To fire something like this out, in front of the people who definitely attended those universities, that was shocking. To this day I don’t know if I was simply naive or if my question was stupid in any way.

if Fraunhofer also a competitor to universities?

Re: Porsche boss faces software woes keeping VW a step behind Tesla

#237

Post by hef19898 »

petre wrote: post #150
brianwawok wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And the US will continue to eat their lunch. How many high impact software companies are coming out of Germany?

SAP. But you wouldn't want to work with SAP anyway. Death by a thousand cuts.

The alternative being? Another ERP system that does the same thing dressed up differently. Cobsidering how many comoanies world wide run SAP, it is fair to say that a true exonomic backbone software comes from Germany. If you take away SAP over night, we are all in a derp recession. If you you take away Facebook overbight, what would happen? Or Amazon, excluding AWS of course?

Re: Porsche boss faces software woes keeping VW a step behind Tesla

#238

Post by WalterBright »

jfim wrote: post #234
MrBuddyCasino wrote: post #196

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Lack of market forces leading to mediocrity I suppose?

Or lack of a profit motive leading to not trying to game metrics as much. If an entity is ranked by some metric, and the better they are that metric, the more profitable they are, then they have an incentive to game it as much as possible.

Metrics are gamed in every organization.

Re: Porsche boss faces software woes keeping VW a step behind Tesla

#239

Post by Gravityloss »

neilv wrote: post #88
gumby wrote: post #15

I've been following this debacle in the German press and I think there's a structural problem that they will struggle to dig their way out of. And by "they" I don't mean just VW, but much of European industry. Software is simply not valued in Europe, and not because there aren't amazing developers there -- there are many. But software isn't considered important Let's start with cars. Back before cars were just comput…

For a long time, there was a meme about "hardware" people not understanding software, and there was enough anecdotal evidence, to make the jokes about it funny. Example: "Never trust a hardware engineer with a keyboard, and never trust a programmer with a screwdriver." I once mentioned this meme (referring to a specific anecdote) in a small group of CS people, and the big-name CS professor in the group immediately ag…

The most complicated projects that humanity has built are software.

The tooling and the culture in the software world is decades ahead of fields like engineering or business management.

Take ideas like version control - a way to do change management. Open source. Test driven development. Continuous integration. These have existed in a nascent way in other fields, but software engineering has really taken the ideas to the next level.

I know some new hardware companies that have taken these approaches to their whole integrated hardware-software development methodology, with extreme success.

So it seems we need new car companies in Europe, and at least one founder probably needs to have used git.

Re: Porsche boss faces software woes keeping VW a step behind Tesla

#240

Post by hef19898 »

WanderPanda wrote: post #208
lokar wrote: post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Atlassian certainly does not value software quality.

To a point where Microsoft should consider acquiring Atlassian because they are so similar in this regard

Nice, then how comes everyone and their grandparents are running Jira and MS Office? The latter across FAANG as well (maybe not the G with an in house competitor).
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