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Mastodon still can’t replace Twitter

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Re: Mastodon still can’t replace Twitter

#111

Post by kaba0 »

safety1st wrote: post #100
M2Ys4U wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>This is only true among mastodon servers that connect to each other. Most do, the default is open federation. > As I recall, most servers would not talk to gab's servers. It's hardly a surprise that most people don't want to associate with neo-Nazis and others with similar worthless ideologies. The fact that admins can firewall off instances if they're are run by arseholes is a good thing.

The problem with this idea is that if by some unfortunate accident of history, Nazis gain power again, they'll say exactly what you just said except replace the word Nazi with Jew. I would flip what you just said on its head and say practically the opposite: the virtue of Mastodon is that when the Nazis seize power not all instances will be forced to censor Jews (whereas Twitter will be forced to do it or shut down).

What exactly is your threat model — every single country will simultaneously become a nazi dictatorship? Is their a world domination beforehand which somehow misses the “nuke the Earth” part?

For a server to operate you only need a very basic power source and internet connection, even in an occupied country it seems plenty doable.

Re: Mastodon still can’t replace Twitter

#112

Post by rvz »

art4ur wrote: post #44
betwixthewires wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not a failure. This idea that it has to be huge to be a success comes from the instagram, Facebook, twitter and YouTube way of counting success. 100 million views, 10k likes in an hour, 100k followers... these humongous numbers are not normal, and they're not necessary for a rewarding social experience online. In fact I think the opposite is true. Lots of people use the network daily. I do. It's more fun than tw…

It's a total failure. John Mastodon, the CEO and founder of Mastodon, was just fired from the company after their stock prices hit an all time low. That's not how it works. It's open source and can be forked and improved upon. It doesn't need millions of users to survive and be useful to a lot of us.

This is how it works today:

Outside of the tech circle, virtually no-one cares at all after 6 years of existence especially with the constant comparisons to Twitter back then and today. This also explains that many people who left Twitter to Mastodon months ago came right back to post on Twitter again because the level of interaction on Mastodon is extremely low.

It isn't early days anymore and 6% of registered users are not using it. If that is not a failure to convince Twitter users to use or migrate to Mastodon, then I don't know what is. Not exactly a convincing elevator pitch for normal users to use outside of tech.

Re: Mastodon still can’t replace Twitter

#113

Post by slater »

rvz wrote: post #110
slater wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It is a failure. It's not a failure.

It is a failure as I have already explained.

Sorry, I thought we were doing the "my opinion is the rightest, because i said so!" thing.

But no, it's not a failure. "low user numbers" does not automagically mean something is a failure, as others in this post have hinted at

Re: Mastodon still can’t replace Twitter

#114

Post by rvz »

slater wrote: post #113
rvz wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is a failure as I have already explained.

Sorry, I thought we were doing the "my opinion is the rightest, because i said so!" thing. But no, it's not a failure. "low user numbers" does not automagically mean something is a failure, as others in this post have hinted at

> Sorry, I thought we were doing the "my opinion is the rightest, because i said so!" thing.

Except mine isn't an 'opinion' and is based on Mastodon's own statistics in daily active user numbers, registered users, user behaviour and the claims, and comparisons made at the time when it already launched and was pitched as a Twitter alternative, especially on HN. [0] [1]

Fast forward 6 years later, 94% of people registered are still not using it. That is virtually no-one, other than the tiny tech circles that even still need to post on Twitter since there is still little to no-one on Mastodon.

That is a fact; not an opinion.

> But no, it's not a failure. "low user numbers" does not automagically mean something is a failure

It is a failure and I have repeatedly shown that the numbers don't lie after 6 years of operation. If it is not a failure, then what I am seeing here is the complete denial of this failure.

[0] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17788060

[1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15514987

Re: Mastodon still can’t replace Twitter

#115

Post by kixiQu »

Matumio wrote: post #97
Alekhine wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> This... is what I do How do you do that? When I used Mastodon, I could only see my own instance's local timeline and the federated timeline. Basically, how do I Mastodon?

For initial discovery you can (web-)browse a large instance by hashtag. Results will include posts from other instances. Then you follow anyone who is posting or boosting interesting stuff. On a large instance you can also subscribe to tags. I don't think you can remote-subscribe to tags (except via RSS). On a small instance tags are less useful as they only show posts the instance already knows about (e.g. from peop…

All of this is correct!

I use an instance I host myself that only has one other user on it. I've found that in such a case you have to follow very aggressively (to get content federating over to your instance; X who I follow RTed something from Y that sounds interesting, Y's profile seems like a good vibe, I follow) and unfollow aggressively (Y is live-tooting a reality show with many, many posts), which is kind of doing the work more manually that Twitter's algorithmic regime does for you. But it's also giving you control, so... trade-offs.

Re: Mastodon still can’t replace Twitter

#116

Post by gargron »

rvz wrote: post #109
pgcj_poster wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

192,000 is not "virtually no one." There are a about dozen sovereign nations with fewer people.

> 192,000 is not "virtually no one." Yes it is, when compared to the total number of registered Mastodon users as I have mentioned from the start with "virtually" meaning 'nearly' , 'almost' , 'more or less' , 'close to' . My use of the word could not get any more accurate and clearer. 192,000 of 3,000,000 is around 6.4%, where that is closer to 0 than 94% is, meaning that approximately 2,808,000 users are still not…

Why the obsession with total registered users? Do Twitter or Facebook even publish that data? I cannot find it. Every number they use is based on MAU or DAU. Which is because the registered users number is quite meaningless. It just goes up over time. Spammers, bots, multiple accounts, banned accounts. No business or service has a 100% retention rate. Half a million MAU is not the scale of Twitter, but it's not nothing, and it's way more people than you'll ever want to have in your home feed.

Re: Mastodon still can’t replace Twitter

#117

Post by gargron »

rvz wrote: post #112
art4ur wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a total failure. John Mastodon, the CEO and founder of Mastodon, was just fired from the company after their stock prices hit an all time low. That's not how it works. It's open source and can be forked and improved upon. It doesn't need millions of users to survive and be useful to a lot of us.

This is how it works today: Outside of the tech circle, virtually no-one cares at all after 6 years of existence especially with the constant comparisons to Twitter back then and today. This also explains that many people who left Twitter to Mastodon months ago came right back to post on Twitter again because the level of interaction on Mastodon is extremely low. It isn't early days anymore and 6% of registered users…

Mastodon is used by German and European government agencies (e.g. social.bund.de, social.network.europa.eu). There was a real-life meet-up of Mastodon users a few hours away from where I live last month. Jan Boehmermann, a German comedian and TV personality started his own Mastodon server, and the Mastodon logo appears in the intro of his TV show. The uni I studied at uses it, and so does the bank I use.

Re: Mastodon still can’t replace Twitter

#118

Post by michaelmrose »

vorejdajo wrote: post #91
michaelmrose wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is a difference between blocking every other server and blocking a singular server and the different shades between. In particular gab is full of toxic, stupid, offensive, psychos wearing human skin masks so that they can blend in and prey upon actual humans. Most people when consuming content at scale want SOME filter on the content whether they know it or not unless the community is very small and self select…

The block if any should be at the user level per user and not at the admin level. No matter what gab user's beliefs are, it's wrong to dehumanize them. If anything, you're doing the same thing you're accusing them of doing: Dehumanizing humans with different (race)beliefs to commit (genocide) segregation.

But you CAN choose at the individual level. If the server you are on doesn't implement your desired policy you can move to another or host your own.

Re: Mastodon still can’t replace Twitter

#119

Post by gargron »

roenxi wrote: post #66
gargron wrote: post #39

The author seems under to be under the wrong impression that Mastodon servers are isolated communities (and therefore compares them to subreddits). This is incorrect. Mastodon is a platform where a server of your choosing hosts your account, like an e-mail provider hosting your inbox. From that account, you follow any other account on the network, regardless of which server hosts that account. Everyone you follow app…

Greetings ordinary and non-remarkable commenter who has no special insight into Mastodon's workings! I don't know anything about the project but I have been watching the journey of the big social networks with interest. If you're taking questions - what do you think are the typical needs of new users as they hear about and start trying mastodon? How do you envision onboarding happening?

Number one priority for onboarding is giving new users something interesting to see. We've made big strides in this direction this year. There's a new "Explore" screen in our official apps that shows trending posts, hashtags, and news articles. We also have a system of follow recommendations.

Re: Mastodon still can’t replace Twitter

#120

Post by imwillofficial »

elsjaako wrote: post #82
imwillofficial wrote: post #42

After mastadon started blocking stuff they didn’t like at the client level, I bailed.

I think you are referring to some of the mobile clients not interacting with gab. This wasn't mastodon itself. It's an open protocol, anyone can write a client. If you're referring to something else let me know, I'd be interested.

Just because anyone can work around it, doesn’t mean they should have to. If the package maintainers themselves are censoring stuff as best they can, that’s beyond the pale.

Gab had no more toxic content than any twitter thread on a contentious topic.

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