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Ask HN: Is there a developer laptop that does not suck and is not a Mac in 2022?

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Re: Ask HN: Is there a developer laptop that does not suck and is not a Mac in 2022?

#151

I'm a happy owner of a Dell Precision 5520 that is already 5 years old. It shipped with a Ubuntu LTS by default and I took a 3-year next day repair warranty that I used once for a swollen battery. I cannot express how happy I was to have my laptop repaired in less than an hour in my kitchen by a Dell certified technician. Given how dependent I am on my computer for work, if I had to send it I would have lost at least…

> For my next laptop, I'm waiting for Framework

Can the Framework laptop be powered via USB-C or are they still using power jacks like in the 20th century?

Re: Ask HN: Is there a developer laptop that does not suck and is not a Mac in 2022?

#152
post #92

ASUS OLED Zenbook Ryzen 5900 + Manjaro. Perf benchmarks compare to an M1 at half the price. The Wifi network card driver doesn't handle hibernates too well, so you need to disable your network manually before (Or replace the network adapter card as some have done).

Do you have sound? Both speakers and microphone? It seems to not be handled too well yet.

Sound yes, microphone haven't tried. I can do a writeup on my install notes and post it here on the weekend.

Re: Ask HN: Is there a developer laptop that does not suck and is not a Mac in 2022?

#153

I will second the others who have recommended Lenovo: I have a Legion 5 I originally bought for gaming but the keyboard is so good I find myself using it for nearly all my development. Additionally, the Dell Precision line (the business workstation-replacement line) is exceptional for development, but those can be as expensive as equivalent MacBooks. Stay away from Dell's pure consumer line: the build quality is abso…

I also recommend Lenovo, including their Chromebooks. Yes, for development, on Linux. This surprised me too, I can open my IDE which runs on Linux and have my Android and ChromeOS apps.

Yes, only 8Gb of RAM but they are offering Chromebooks with twice that amount, which is enough for anyone, right?!?

I do not need sound but the audio on my Lenovo "Flex 5" is awesome. No complaints about the keyboard, trackpad or screen.

Fantastic that my Chromebook is, it is only with an 11th gen CPU, and a mere i5. I have only discovered it is good for development out of laziness, the Chromebook is in the front room and not in the study. I start researching something whilst taking a break and, with that terminal window so close by, I give things a go.

I have another recommendation - Huawei. The trick is to buy from their website and not via a retailer. This is because there will be a deal where you might get a monitor or other accessory bundled in.

I have the Huawei ultrabook from 2020 (Matebook X) and that has a low power CPU and is not my development machine. It is my official 'research' machine. I have this directly connected with a Thunderbolt cable to a Huawei Matebook 16s 2022 edition. This has the 12th gen i7 with many cores and plenty of performance for running whatever you want.

The thunderbolt networking and Barrier/Synergy means that I have access to my files and screens from either machine at speeds that make wifi feel like dial up networking. There is much to recommend about this arrangement, particularly since the high speed network drops down to wifi if the cable is unplugged. I also have the DNS rigged so that both machines 'resolve' globally, with my files available on whatever network is available.

Regarding the Huawei Matebook 16s, it has a 16" 3:2 display with 2520 pixels across. This means I can run 1:1 pixels with no scaling and still be able to work with my IDE effectively. As mentioned, I have my 'research' machine (Matebook X) to do browsing and testing, with magic keyboard/mouse sharing thanks to Barrier. Even though I am using the 'development' machine for commpilation, running DBs and the IDE, the sleeker Matebook X is the device I am physically using.

Sometimes reviewers place importance on features that do not matter to the developer. All laptops are a design compromise and you take your choices. I don't play games or wish to be tempted by gaming. Right now I don't do anything in 3D so I needed a GPU as much as a fish needs a bicycle. I also did not want the i9 version which wants 135W of USB-C power. The single core speed was not 'better'. Plus throttling could happen.

Anyway, the Huawei Matebook 16s has a gorgeous screen for programming, but the gamer or content creator might complain about the refresh/latency/colours. I don't care, I just want pixels that are abundant. The aluminium case is not Dell creaky plastic with a rocket engine roaring away. The keyboard/trackpad are great but the speakers are not. I am happy with that because I really did not buy the machine for games/Netflix/video editing or anything else where I 'need' something as good as Lenovo's MaxxAudio(r).

YMMV, I have been given many XPS machines over the years, none of which I have 'bonded with'. Although Lenovo is my goto brand, for absolute quality, bang per buck and a nice change, I can't recommend Huawei highly enough. Ubuntu worked perfectly out the box on the Matebook X and on the 12th gen 16s I had to disable suspend, because it wasn't waking up. Actually I did not want the machine going to sleep anyway, so I have not investigated further.

A lot of shade has been thrown Huawei's way over the years. I just want to write my best code and I chuckle at the thought of those senile politicians trying to tell me what phone/computer I have.

Re: Ask HN: Is there a developer laptop that does not suck and is not a Mac in 2022?

#155

I'm a happy owner of a Dell Precision 5520 that is already 5 years old. It shipped with a Ubuntu LTS by default and I took a 3-year next day repair warranty that I used once for a swollen battery. I cannot express how happy I was to have my laptop repaired in less than an hour in my kitchen by a Dell certified technician. Given how dependent I am on my computer for work, if I had to send it I would have lost at least…

I am also the happy owner of a Dell Precision, but an even older model, 7510, so 6-years old. It has never had any HW problem, despite intensive use, including during many business trips.

It was also bought with Ubuntu, but I have wiped that and I have installed Gentoo, as this is what I prefer. Support for Linux has been perfect, for all included peripherals, e.g. Thunderbolt, video camera, WiFi, Bluetooth, card reader, etc.

This heavier model has a modest battery life, which is normal for a laptop containing the top Mobile Xeon CPU and the top NVIDIA Quadro GPU of that year. Unlike lighter laptops, it has excellent cooling, which allows the CPU to dissipate 60 W for an indefinite time (despite the official TDP of only 45 W) allowing the fast compilation of large software projects, without thermal throttling and without excessive noise.

I develop software for embedded computers, so a I need a laptop like this Dell Precision 7000 series, with a large number of USB ports and with Ethernet, to be able to connect to various prototypes and development boards.

In conclusion, I can recommend the Dell Precision 7000 series for software development, especially under Linux. Unfortunately, they are rather overpriced, which is also true about all the other laptops labelled as "mobile workstations".

Re: Ask HN: Is there a developer laptop that does not suck and is not a Mac in 2022?

#156

Please excuse the long-winded answer... I have also given up on Apple, but mostly because I can't see the value in it anymore, otherwise my experience with them has been satisfactory (Intel CPU models). For the past few years I used a Microsoft Surface Pro because it seemed to have good build quality and high screen resolution, but despite this I have had to replace it as part of a recall due to a graphics hardware i…

> For 2022 I decided to buy a "gaming" laptop and switch to 100% Linux. I researched this option before opting for an LG gram. I might research it again soon. Would you care to share exactly what gaming laptop you picked?

Not OP, but I've heard great things about the Asus ROG Zephyrus line, and that's what I'll probably get when i refresh my current Asus laptop which id approaching 8 years.

Re: Ask HN: Is there a developer laptop that does not suck and is not a Mac in 2022?

#157

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> 14inch display. Yeah, but for serious dev work, 14 inches is just a flat out no. 16 inch is the bare minimum and already feels cramped.

Serious dev work is not done mostly on a small screen. Your laptop is a moveable computer that will be connected to your workstation monitor. I own a 14 inch macbook and rarely use it without a display.

If you use it hitched to a monitor, then why not have a proper workstation?

The whole point of having a laptop is being able to use it on the go.

I travel by train and plane extensively and I write code on it during the trips.

14 inches is unusable.

Re: Ask HN: Is there a developer laptop that does not suck and is not a Mac in 2022?

#158

The current (2022) LG Gram come with Intel Alder Lake and dual USB4/TB4, they basically seem to be the only interesting competitors to the lightweight Apple laptops. The 14" model is 1.0 kg compared to the M1 Macbook Air at 1.3 kg. Linux compatibility is very good with current kernels (I had a few DRM/GuC restarts with 5.18, those seem to be fixed in 5.19), all hardware works out of the box. ADL-P power management is…

>The current (2022) LG Gram I use a 16 inches 2021 model (so an 11th gen Intel CPU instead of Alder Lake) on a daily basis both at the office and on the go, running Ubuntu 20.04LTS I really, really like it: - runs Linux out of the box - *extremely* lightweight - battery lasts forever even with CPU-hungry workloads, typically a full day. - very nice 16 inches hi-rez (2560 x 1600) screen - very comfortable keyboard and…

On the 2022 version the speakers work out of the box. For the touchpad I prefer touch gestures instead of the mechanical clicking, but haven't noticed any issues so far. Gestures work really well on Linux (Fedora 36, KDE, not sure if it matters). Only pinch-to-zoom is bit janky at times, but 2D scrolling, one/two/three finger tapping, tap'n'drag and even switching fingers around for long drags all just works and is nice and smooth. Not missing a trackpoint.

As far as external displays go, if I understand it correctly these can drive a total of three external displays, both of the USB-C/TB4 ports should have DP alt mode and MST besides the HDMI output.

I'm honestly a bit surprised about the LG Gram series - you'd think there would be more talk about it. I didn't even know LG was making laptops, let alone such good ones; I only learned about them a few weeks ago by a random drive-by comment here on HN were someone mentioned them and that Linux just works, few weeks later I ended up having to buy a laptop on very short notice and remembered that comment.

Re: Ask HN: Is there a developer laptop that does not suck and is not a Mac in 2022?

#160
post #80
post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

TIL one can collapse HN threads. With all the clear labels on HN, perhaps a [collapse] link would have been clearer.

Were you never curious about what the little [-] did? Where's your sense of adventure! I rib you, but at the same time I understand and your idea has merit.

I might have used it at some time, but must have forgot it since then. I now find it super useful to be able to collapse long threads, to see what others have posted :D
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