TikTok is manipulative, addictive, and harmful to privacy • Hacker News Board

Re: TikTok is manipulative, addictive, and harmful to privacy

#91

Post by echelon » Sun, Aug 28, 2022, 11:31 PM UTC

8f2ab37a-ed6c wrote: post #57

I'm with the rest of the commenters here in being puzzled about why TikTok is being singled out here with respect to the other social media apps. It's like comparing whiskey, vodka, and tequila in terms of health risks. You can't single out one as particularly pernicious when they do about the same thing.

1. TikTok appears to be the optimum in social media platform evolution for the foreseeable future. The other platforms don't even come close. TikTok presents a perfect stream of user interests - no "friends" that bare little interest graph similarity. It's all delivered in a video funnel (great for ads) and A/B tests are so natural they're part of the platform itself. Highly optimized dopamine-triggering doom scrolling perfectly tailored to the viewer.

2. Some people are worried about the CCP exerting control to learn about sensitive leaders and their families [1] or to persuade populations at scale [2]. The app has been shown to capture all keyboard input [3], clipboard contents [4], and record much more than it needs to function. Furthermore, all US-based social media is blocked in China, and there's an argument for reciprocity. The topic of Facebook being used to gather international intelligence for the US is not typically mentioned in the same conversations.

[1] opinion; https://www.wsj.com/articles/on-tiktok-its-all-fun-and-games...

[2] https://www.economist.com/interactive/briefing/2022/07/09/th...

[3] https://www.notebookcheck.net/TikTok-is-monitoring-all-keybo...

[4] https://threatpost.com/tiktok-to-stop-clipboard-snooping-aft...

Re: TikTok is manipulative, addictive, and harmful to privacy

#92

Post by SXX » Sun, Aug 28, 2022, 11:32 PM UTC

boomboomsubban wrote: post #50

suggestion wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're not paying with your data, you're paying with the foundations of functioning society and democracy that are being algorithmically subverted by a totalitarian slave state. The very things that trend on TikTok in the West are banned and filtered in China for a reason.

Jingoism. "Facebook may algorithmically subvert the foundations of society and democracy, but at least it's being done by a state I support."

Not that I support Facebook, but it's impossible to be moral absolutist in today's world. You either support western democracy with all it's imperfections or you are supporting authoritarian / totalitarian states. Everyone who pretend to be "politically neutral" will always be helping later.

UPD: Yeah I meant "later" and not "former". Corrected.

Re: TikTok is manipulative, addictive, and harmful to privacy

#93

Post by justapassenger » Sun, Aug 28, 2022, 11:33 PM UTC

8f2ab37a-ed6c wrote: post #57

I'm with the rest of the commenters here in being puzzled about why TikTok is being singled out here with respect to the other social media apps. It's like comparing whiskey, vodka, and tequila in terms of health risks. You can't single out one as particularly pernicious when they do about the same thing.

Facebook, IG, Snapchat and other old social apps already had their fair share of dirt thrown at them. TikTok didn’t, and lots of people think that they are just a cool app for teenagers to record their dancing.

So it’s more about telling people who already know that alcohol is bad, that White Claw is also bad.

Re: TikTok is manipulative, addictive, and harmful to privacy

#94

Post by ssnistfajen » Sun, Aug 28, 2022, 11:33 PM UTC

badRNG wrote: post #14

sfvegandude wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No it does not apply just as well to almost any social media. TikTok is unique in its control of the user experience, its use of data, and its popularity. Best not to throw this on the pile of “well duh, it’s social media — of course it’s bad.” TikTok is spyware. TikTok is an adversary. TikTok must be regulated. Let’s talk about TikTok in this comments section, and not zoom out like we so often do.

> TikTok is spyware. TikTok is an adversary. In what unique ways is TikTok compromising privacy that Facebook isn't that warrants the labels of "spyware" and being "the adversary?"

TikTok is made by China, considered an all-encompassing adversary by proponents of nationalism, conflict, and hatred. Therefore it makes TikTok an "adversary" despite the only unique thing it did was eating into Meta's marketshares.

It's very telling when it comes to topics marginally related to general idea of China (the place, the people, the culture, etc.), these so-called free thinker intellectuals seamlessly transition into Goebbel-like devices as if a switch has been flipped on.

Re: TikTok is manipulative, addictive, and harmful to privacy

#95

Post by suggestion » Sun, Aug 28, 2022, 11:33 PM UTC

boomboomsubban wrote: post #50

suggestion wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're not paying with your data, you're paying with the foundations of functioning society and democracy that are being algorithmically subverted by a totalitarian slave state. The very things that trend on TikTok in the West are banned and filtered in China for a reason.

Jingoism. "Facebook may algorithmically subvert the foundations of society and democracy, but at least it's being done by a state I support."

If it's jingoism to support Western enlightenment values, liberal democracy, and basic human rights, then yeah I guess I'm a jingo.

Re: TikTok is manipulative, addictive, and harmful to privacy

#96

Post by GauntletWizard » Sun, Aug 28, 2022, 11:33 PM UTC

initplus wrote: post #89

8f2ab37a-ed6c wrote: post #57

I'm with the rest of the commenters here in being puzzled about why TikTok is being singled out here with respect to the other social media apps. It's like comparing whiskey, vodka, and tequila in terms of health risks. You can't single out one as particularly pernicious when they do about the same thing.

All social media apps have the same goal: soak up as much of your attention as possible to get you to look at ads. But it's a difference of degrees, TikTok is simply so much more successful at soaking up peoples attention than competing platforms. TikTok is seriously affecting peoples quality of life en-masse in a way that social media has never achieved before. Any social media person will tell you how insane the nu…

Facebook was equally as effective when it launched. People were spending all day on Facebook, then spending all day on Farmville, then spending all day on Instagram. People got tired of it. People move on to new things.

Re: TikTok is manipulative, addictive, and harmful to privacy

#97

Post by enos_feedler » Sun, Aug 28, 2022, 11:34 PM UTC

CharlesW wrote: post #87

8f2ab37a-ed6c wrote: post #57

I'm with the rest of the commenters here in being puzzled about why TikTok is being singled out here with respect to the other social media apps. It's like comparing whiskey, vodka, and tequila in terms of health risks. You can't single out one as particularly pernicious when they do about the same thing.

TikTok is a completely different experience than any form of social media that's come before. It's like comparing weed with heroin.

More like 60s weed vs 2020s weed

Re: TikTok is manipulative, addictive, and harmful to privacy

#98

Post by dragonsky67 » Sun, Aug 28, 2022, 11:34 PM UTC

daqnal wrote: post #32

badRNG wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> TikTok is spyware. TikTok is an adversary. In what unique ways is TikTok compromising privacy that Facebook isn't that warrants the labels of "spyware" and being "the adversary?"

Its legislation. More transparent governments like the US' are generally trusted with data over closed governments, at least, for the majority of Westerners.

I think I'm far less likely to be impacted by China having access to the intimate detail of my life, than my own countries government or companies based in my country.

I can't see the Chinese government selling my medical information to health insurers, but could certainly see a local company doing this.

Re: TikTok is manipulative, addictive, and harmful to privacy

#99

Post by anothernewdude » Sun, Aug 28, 2022, 11:34 PM UTC

miguelazo wrote: post #62

angio wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's because China has strict censorship laws while the US protects free speech. TikTok (like Meta) follows local regulations when it comes to their content.

lol… free speech for those who don’t rock the boat. Go ask someone in the US who criticizes Israel in any serious way how their employment prospects are going.

Go ask the buried corpses of those in China who criticize the CCP anything.

Re: TikTok is manipulative, addictive, and harmful to privacy

#100

Post by suggestion » Sun, Aug 28, 2022, 11:35 PM UTC

angio wrote: post #47

suggestion wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're not paying with your data, you're paying with the foundations of functioning society and democracy that are being algorithmically subverted by a totalitarian slave state. The very things that trend on TikTok in the West are banned and filtered in China for a reason.

That's because China has strict censorship laws while the US protects free speech. TikTok (like Meta) follows local regulations when it comes to their content.

No it's because TikTok is owned by the CCP and used as a tool to sow discord and subvert liberal democratic values so that it may destabilize the west and pave the way for CCP supremacy.