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Is there hope for Linux on smartphones? [video]

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Re: Is there hope for Linux on smartphones? [video]

#61

Post by sgc »

makz wrote: post #24

Before answering that question I'd ask: why would we want that? My answer is no, it didn't work on the desktop, it won't work on the smartphone, for more or less the same reasons. As much as I like Linux and FOSS, Linux is just a bad OS for the average consumer. For hackers, makers, DYI enthusiasts, etc. Linux is wonderful, however, what's the market size for a Linux smart phone for this people? I bet it's tiny.

Why is it 'just bad'? I have installed Linux (either Debian or Ubuntu) for several non-tech-savvy family members, and they have used them for years without incident. I once talked to my mom about Linux and she mentioned that her Windows worked great for everything, she would never change. I told her to look at the splash screen when she booted up ;)! She had been on Linux for a good 10 years without noticing.

Re: Is there hope for Linux on smartphones? [video]

#62

Post by sgc »

z3t4 wrote: post #39

Nokia had Linux on their smartphone until Microsoft bought them and stopped everything, they even shut down the app store. The OS was called MeeGo. Part of the Nokia team however started their own company called Jolla and still produce smartphones running Linux, they call their OS Sailfish. (ignoring the fact that Android also uses the Linux kernel). The problem with alternative phone OS:es is that in the country I l…

I could get by with only using banking websites in the browser. But Why does Jolla not yet support any Pixel phones? I have wanted to try it out for years, but not to the point of trying to make things work on my own.

Re: Is there hope for Linux on smartphones? [video]

#64

Post by cassianoleal »

matrix12 wrote: post #11
jrockway wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is this the one time people should be calling it GNU/Linux?

Very fine point. GNU runs on many operating systems, and so to conflate GNU and Linux seems absurd.

GNU runs on many kernels. GNU is part of the operating systems where it runs.

Re: Is there hope for Linux on smartphones? [video]

#65

Post by zozbot234 »

kitsunesoba wrote: post #22
NuSkooler wrote: post #18

It's mentioned already, but: Android. Discounting Android as "Not Linux" enough is a mind boggle to me. Perhaps not "GNU" enough, but certainly the spirit of Linux -- customized for the particular needs, stable, fast, works on a plethora of hardware, etc.

Vanilla Android or AOSP might kinda have “Linux Spirit” but I’m not sure what gets shipped on most consumer devices does… lots of random things locked down (including boot loader, sometimes), crapware all over the place, drivers and kernel changes that aren’t upstreamed making it difficult to install anything but carrier/manufacturer-flavored Android, etc. I think most people rooting for “smartphone Linux” are lookin…

Even AOSP is running something quite far from a mainline kernel, although they've been gradually reducing the delta with Linux proper. It really is a fork.

Re: Is there hope for Linux on smartphones? [video]

#66

Post by dredmorbius »

orangepurple wrote: post #46
dredmorbius wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Termux is a godsend on Android, and remains The Only App Which Does Not Specifically and Precisely Suck (though EinkBro is giving it a good run for its money). Termux still has a host of limitations and weaknesses which are imposed by the Android environment itself , including being capriciously killed by the OS, lack of multiple users, blocked access to most of the filesystem, and a relatively limited (though impres…

Termux is awesome but the native environment is suffocating. I didn't even bother with Termux utilities after one hour of messing around. I went straight for the Arch Linux ARM proot environment and it contains ALL of the Arch Linux utilities. For example you will never get scipy to compile in normal Termux because you can't reasonably get a compatible Fortran compiler built and configured. Arch Linux ARM is the best…

Suffocating for lack of packages?

I'll note that Termux has about 1/3 the package count of RHEL / CentOS. It's not everything, but for a mobile distro, it's quite good.

That said:

1. Thanks for the Arch suggestion. I'll take a look at that. Root required?

2. Even with a full-fledged distro installed, if you're running unrooted Android you're still grossly crippled by the overarching (so to speak) Android system in terms of filesystem and process management and interference.

Re: Is there hope for Linux on smartphones? [video]

#67

Post by nfriedly »

nivenkos wrote: post #53
lrvick wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Android is Linux but it has nowhere close to the fully open source freedom of a traditional Linux workstation. This is why I carry a tiny linux laptop.

What do you use a small laptop? Seems there's nothing ultralight and small like the Asus Eee and Acer Aspire One these days (even though you'd think it'd be easier with ARM now).

Not the OP, but you should take a look at https://www.gpd.hk/ they have a handful of small devices targeted at different niches.

Re: Is there hope for Linux on smartphones? [video]

#68

Post by what-imright »

tingletech wrote: post #33
what-imright wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why is the title “Is there hope for linux on smartphones?”? If it said “Is there hope for GNU on smartphones?” the answer would be a resounding no, because the community is fractured and politicized to the degree the products are uncompetitive. Pinephone is an example. Then there was the Ubuntu effort. Android, being partly closed as the GPL2 allows for, is proof that Linux can be highly successful without the GNU cr…

most of the user space tools originated from GNU (such as gcc), linux really just brought the kernel.

Just? It’s 28 million lines of code, the world’s largest software project

Re: Is there hope for Linux on smartphones? [video]

#69

Post by zozbot234 »

nivenkos wrote: post #53
lrvick wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Android is Linux but it has nowhere close to the fully open source freedom of a traditional Linux workstation. This is why I carry a tiny linux laptop.

What do you use a small laptop? Seems there's nothing ultralight and small like the Asus Eee and Acer Aspire One these days (even though you'd think it'd be easier with ARM now).

> What do you use a small laptop? Seems there's nothing ultralight and small like the Asus Eee and Acer Aspire One these days

They're called "Ultrabooks" now. Buy an older one on the used market if you don't care about top performance.

Re: Is there hope for Linux on smartphones? [video]

#70

Post by linmob »

branon wrote: post #60
ddevault wrote: post #13

I'm typing this comment from a Poco F1 I set up with postmarketOS and Phosh earlier this week and so far it's very promising. Will write up a proper review next week. Much better than the Pinephone so far.

This is interesting. Communities like postmarketOS put in a lot of effort to adapt their distribution to hardware that would otherwise be running Android. Perhaps targeting commodity hardware is a more viable strategy than contending with newer platforms like Pinephone. Sure the device is more open, but most of the software support falls on the same community of developers. Lord knows they have enough build targets t…

Things keep improving, slowly but surely. BTW: Mepo is a mapping app that performs great on the PinePhone: https://sr.ht/~mil/Mepo/
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