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Apple surpassed $3.5B in annual revenue from its ad network

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Re: Apple surpassed $3.5B in annual revenue from its ad network

#71

Post by thomasahle »

ArtTimeInvestor wrote: post #56

As an Apple investor, I am happy to seem them grow an advertising business. Human attention is the ultimate analog resource. Throughout our lifetime, it will stay in high demand. It cannot be inflated away or commoditized. What I don't get is: How can Apple prevent or even detect that other apps or websites tell Facebook about what you do? If I go to example.com and example.com sends fingerprinting and useage informa…

> how would Apple know?

I don't think they can. As far as I understand what they blocked was the ability of the Facebook app to send Metadata to the website that the user arrived by the action of clicking an ad. They also blocked the website being able to reply to the Facebook app whether the user bought anything. This way users og Facebook ads aren't able to see whether their ads are effective, which lower the value of them.

In principle Facebook and the website could store these events (ad clicking and item buying) on their own servers, and just synchronize once in a while. I don't know if they are working on this or it already exists.

However, Apple could threaten to kick the Facebook app of the platform if it provides this "service" to advertisers.

Re: Apple surpassed $3.5B in annual revenue from its ad network

#72

Post by nemothekid »

cycomanic wrote: post #54
nojito wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m surprised that people still call Apples stance a “story” All they are saying is that tracking is ok as long as you just ask the end user first. Here’s Steve Jobs in 2010 https://youtube.com/watch?v=Ij-jlF98SzA Are they perfect? No. But at least they haven’t changed their stance in 12 years unlike Google et al.

The problem with that narrative is that apple does not apply the same rules to themselves. I actually agree with apple tracking should be optional, however why should apple get a free pass?

>The problem with that narrative is that apple does not apply the same rules to themselves

What do you mean? Apple tracking is optional, they straight up ask when you setup your phone.

Re: Apple surpassed $3.5B in annual revenue from its ad network

#73

Post by adamsmith143 »

plantain wrote: post #68

> But it crushed [snip] 1000s of small businesses in the process. There's a lot of comments here suggesting this is a narrative from FB/Snap, but it really isn't. I was previously able to target adverts directly to the tiny audience of potential users of my product, and the return on those adverts was nearly 10x. Overnight it entirely evaporated as a source of new customers and I don't know how I'd build a niche busi…

Operating a business with a single point of failure is never wise.

Re: Apple surpassed $3.5B in annual revenue from its ad network

#74

Post by TakeBlaster16 »

fancl20 wrote: post #46
uncomputation wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, I read about Ramon and his wiener dog ramps when this was first submitted to HN months ago and I said the same thing then as I am now. It’s bullshit. If Ramon wants to sell wiener dog ramps, then the system to do that should be “buy adspace when people search for wiener dog,” advertise on wiener dog enthusiast forums, sponsor videos/meetups, etc. Not “create an all knowing digital surveillance system tying toge…

I mean, wether this is a bullshit won't affect "Small business were crushed by Apple" is a fact? It's a statement based on data. How you or apple justifying their behaviour is another story.

Let's say a chemical is found to cause cancer (outside of the state of California), then Walmart pulls all offending products from the shelves. Would you say Walmart is "crushing" these manufacturing businesses, or would you say Walmart is keeping their customers safe?

Re: Apple surpassed $3.5B in annual revenue from its ad network

#75

Post by forestwisp »

bengale wrote: post #55
cycomanic wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem with that narrative is that apple does not apply the same rules to themselves. I actually agree with apple tracking should be optional, however why should apple get a free pass?

They do though, they've asked me on the iPhone if I want to have personalised ads, and I said no. Now I don't get personalised ads.

This implies collecting data for ad personalization is the only means through each Apple tracks you, which clearly isn't the case [1]. Some interesting keypoints posted here before: [2]

As it currently stands, there is no way to "opt out" of being tracked by Apple.

[1] https://www.scss.tcd.ie/doug.leith/apple_google.pdf

[2] https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=false&qu...

Re: Apple surpassed $3.5B in annual revenue from its ad network

#76

Post by nemothekid »

cloutchaser wrote: post #32
uncomputation wrote: post #24

> But it crushed FB, Snap, and 1000s of small businesses in the process. Ironically, this is far more of a narrative than this guy’s idea of Apple’s “narrative.” The idea that banning user tracking hurts small businesses was FB’s narrative to try and get backlash against Apple for its tracking crackdown. That genuinely is a narrative because from Apple’s decision we have seen that consumers (1) prefer not to be track…

No, you are factually incorrect, but getting upvotes for a pretty populist view. As with most centralization or “regulation” (this case from a private company), it hurts the smallest companies the most. Large brand advertisers don’t care about granular targeting because they have the budget to just advertise to everyone. By definition the very smallest advertisers are the one who are getting restricted here. Luckily…

Small business were also crushed when the FDA started requiring clinical trials before you could market your drugs. The assumption here is that the needs of small businesses trumps any ethical or moral concerns. We shouldn't have prop up Big Brother so that little Johnny can sell graphic t-shirts.

Re: Apple surpassed $3.5B in annual revenue from its ad network

#78

Post by praestigiare »

plantain wrote: post #68

> But it crushed [snip] 1000s of small businesses in the process. There's a lot of comments here suggesting this is a narrative from FB/Snap, but it really isn't. I was previously able to target adverts directly to the tiny audience of potential users of my product, and the return on those adverts was nearly 10x. Overnight it entirely evaporated as a source of new customers and I don't know how I'd build a niche busi…

The people who have obviously made their preferences clear that they prefer not to be profiled and tracked that way, because the possibility is still there for those who consent to tracking.

Re: Apple surpassed $3.5B in annual revenue from its ad network

#79

Post by Jcowell »

plantain wrote: post #68

> But it crushed [snip] 1000s of small businesses in the process. There's a lot of comments here suggesting this is a narrative from FB/Snap, but it really isn't. I was previously able to target adverts directly to the tiny audience of potential users of my product, and the return on those adverts was nearly 10x. Overnight it entirely evaporated as a source of new customers and I don't know how I'd build a niche busi…

> Advertising gets a bad rap, but I like to believe I am providing value to my customers and they wouldn't have found my product otherwise. Who was hurt?

Probably. But if the means in which you can connect with those customers requires a surveillance apparatus that infringes on the privacy of the unconsented than perhaps the question that should be asked is does your business have a greater right to exists than the privacy of those customers (I’m guessing the reason you can’t reach them anymore is because they decided to no longer be tracked.

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