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Ask HN: Depressed, need to leave web development, what can I do?

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Re: Ask HN: Depressed, need to leave web development, what can I do?

#51

Post by jiggywiggy »

jaitaiwan wrote: post #12

Seems like you’re experiencing burn-out and from what I’ve read and experienced, burn out is a function of emotional investment vs the emotional return. So I see that you have two options both of which shouldn’t happen before first taking a small break: 1. Continue to work in the industry and reduce your emotional investment. Hint: great places for that are big corporates. 2. Continue to work while upskilling in anot…

I would be careful with corporates

Most people who had burn outs in my life had it while working for corporates, where actually there was hardly any pressure outwardly, but they all put it on themselves inwardly.

Outwardly there was hardly anything going on, but I think the internal politics & having a personality being sensitive to social pressure played a role. But not fully sure.

Sometimes I'm more tired when there is hardly anything to do, or when there is no real possibility to add any value because there is so many stiff ideas floating around. I prefer hard work but with real results then corporate cushions. Maybe that also plays a role for certain people.

The best places are in my experience team with a reasonable goal, people who care for the goal and each other and there is pressure but also understanding.

Re: Ask HN: Depressed, need to leave web development, what can I do?

#53

Post by sli »

clouddrover wrote: post #26
5350-uiop-1130 wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Do you think you might have let your own skill set stagnate? yes, definitely. although i worked a lot with node and react, building electron apps, cli tools, browsers extensions - but i just don't enjoy it anymore. and i don't have experience building large scale production apps with the latest trendy stacks. > The fact you think 300+ people are applying to the same jobs means the market might be saturated with tho…

> but its usually some typescript challenge or something like that - which i refused to learn, since i already know javascript. once static type checking became a requirement in front end is like the intersection for when i became a dinosaur Why? Static type checking is a good thing to reduce errors.

TypeScript is a Microsoft band-aid on problems far better solved by other languages. The level to which people praise it feels like Stockholm Syndrome, and criticizing it frequently gets the stereotypical toxic programmer forum replies like "well you just don't know how to use types." It's impossible to speak critically about TypeScript unless you write long blog posts.

Re: Ask HN: Depressed, need to leave web development, what can I do?

#54

Post by wruza »

clouddrover wrote: post #26
5350-uiop-1130 wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Do you think you might have let your own skill set stagnate? yes, definitely. although i worked a lot with node and react, building electron apps, cli tools, browsers extensions - but i just don't enjoy it anymore. and i don't have experience building large scale production apps with the latest trendy stacks. > The fact you think 300+ people are applying to the same jobs means the market might be saturated with tho…

> but its usually some typescript challenge or something like that - which i refused to learn, since i already know javascript. once static type checking became a requirement in front end is like the intersection for when i became a dinosaur Why? Static type checking is a good thing to reduce errors.

Also good to increase time to market and make you think more about types, less about business logic. It has both pros and cons depending on what you are doing.

I have learned and can read and write typescript, but it doesn’t click when it comes to “we’ll need it tomorrow to check our ideas fast”, the usual mode of startup operation. These stories about night and day difference also do not match my reality. All my code paths are either hot or tested. How many type-related bugs have I encountered last year? Maybe a few, but can’t remember even a single one. Maybe I’ll gradually type it after we go into maintenance mode, maybe leave it as an exercise to a maintainer if they see fit. My last few projects were successful and brought solid revenue without any type-related issues.

Re: Ask HN: Depressed, need to leave web development, what can I do?

#55

Post by PeterStuer »

StevenWaterman wrote: post #16

Definitely agree with others that it sounds like burnout. I went through it myself about a year ago, and wrote about it recently [1]. Maybe it will help. [1] https://stevenwaterman.uk/opening-up-burnout/

"Eventually, I just had to leave that job, with nothing lined up, and barely any notice. They knew it was coming, and we left on good terms, but it still felt like a failure. I'm in a very priveleged position to be able to do that."

You are, but you don't mention the nr.1 reason in your article: your youth. Unlike you the author is 40 in a commodity IT position where agism is far more than endemic.

I do agree with you on the main premise of the burnaout/depression cause though. I have written the same here in the past.

Re: Ask HN: Depressed, need to leave web development, what can I do?

#58

Post by weatherlite »

Don't give up, the market is in a downturn and its much harder to get a position now. It's not you that is the problem nor your age. I can see in my current company how much choosier we became when considering candidates.

As for web dev, it's a very broad field. You can try backend if you're sick of front end. I'm a full stacker and I'm considering a move to something more low level or algorithmic...we'll see how it goes. Your satisfaction in work also depends a lot on your boss, colleagues and the amount of stress you're experiencing...the actual tools and tasks you work on matter but not that much imo.

Re: Ask HN: Depressed, need to leave web development, what can I do?

#59

Post by hsn915 »

mkl wrote: post #23
hsn915 wrote: post #8

Web development as practiced by the majority of the industry is truly insane and depressing. No one has any idea what they are doing. Here's what I'm aiming to do: learn systems programming on the side, accumulate enough savings to live off of for nearly a year, then go independent and continue learning systems programming "as I go". Build software products on my own and start selling them.

Why not leverage what you know and build web-based products/services?

It will be indeed web related, but not a hosted service with a monthly recurring subscription. Instead, a stand-along product that would allow you to "own" your web presense and not be tied to any specific company.

Re: Ask HN: Depressed, need to leave web development, what can I do?

#60

Post by throwaway_0xff »

dunkelheit wrote: post #35

First, you need to take a big break, a couple of months at least. The less computing-related activities the better. The summer hasn't ended yet, do some outdoorsy stuff with other people. Depending on your situation of course, it may not be possible. Then just radically cut back on work and try to spend more time with your loved ones. Second, you need to get your love for technology back. It is still there, but it ma…

> Second, you need to get your love for technology back. It is still there, but it manifests as hate. My theory of burnout is that it arises when the amount of effort you put in is disproportionally large compared to perceived payoffs. The brain just does a ROI calculation and refuses to put more effort in. To combat that, you need some easy successes.

Just wanted to thank you for this summary. I think you're right, though it certainly doesn't feel like that. I am in a very similar situation as OP, but webdev is only a small part of what I (can) do. I literally hate all of technology right now. At least, it feels like that. Also seems to be age-related. I am 40 and I lost "my spark" about 3-4 years ago. Luckily, still able to work, but the fun is gone and I personally don't believe that I will ever get it back at this point.

Edit: May be relevant to OP: I found a small team with an employer who himself went through burnout and now approaches things a bit differently. Not sure if it helps, but I thought it might be nice to know that those exist.

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