Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

How fast is 12th Gen Intel Core?

frame.work

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

371–380 of 454 posts

Re: How fast is 12th Gen Intel Core?

#371

Post by pizza234 »

ceeplusplus wrote: post #357
pizza234 wrote: post #355

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Compared with the Phoronix Suite, on Linux, just today: https://www.phoronix.com/review/apple-m2-linux/15 . Surprising results. Definitely not in the "very far" range.

From your link: "Even under demanding multi-threaded workloads, the M2 MacBook Air was not nearly as warm as the other laptops tested" Keep in mind the 6850U you're comparing against has a fan too. Notebookcheck says it has a 40W turbo on the gen 2 model, and the gen 3 Intel version has a 28W sustained boost. An M2 uses around 20W. Also, a lot of those benchmarks are showing all x86 CPUs with a 3x+ lead, which indica…

> From your link: "Even under demanding multi-threaded workloads, the M2 MacBook Air was not nearly as warm as the other laptops tested"

> Overall, your results don't seem very valid.

They're not "my" results, and thermals were not part of the discussion.

Regarding performance, if one wants to be rigorous (and that's why I didn't state "68xx is faster than Mx"), one can't make absolute claims either way, as Torvalds himself has criticized Geekbench.

I still think that describing the performance difference as "not very far" is a valid assessment.

Re: How fast is 12th Gen Intel Core?

#372

Post by princevegeta89 »

SpacePortKnight wrote: post #104

In a laptop, I care far more about battery life and the fan noise. However, Intel 12th gen is only able to pull these impressive performance feats due to very high turbo boost clocks. It's not that Intel is bad, it's still pretty great but in the age of M1 I wish Intel released a processor with similar power consumption. I use my Intel i5-1240p with turbo boost disabled when on battery. Here's the geekbench with TB d…

Tested an i7 1260p recently and it ran like a beast. What's interesting is they have a discrete GPU now which is the Intel Arc that should take a lot of the load off the CPU.

Re: How fast is 12th Gen Intel Core?

#373

Post by dont__panic »

jacknews wrote: post #49

The coolest thing isn't just the cpu upgrade, but that the whole mainboard is something like a standard. Other laptops have weird shaped boards just for that one model. If this 'standard' takes off it could start an entire ecosystem of modular hardware. That's exciting. I'm hoping for a 'Framework surface', a 'Framework tv', a 'Framework 400', etc.

I'd pay very very good money for a Framework router or a Framework TV...

Imagine hardware that you control, that you can upgrade piecemeal when something gets out of date. Besides the eco friendliness, it just sounds... nice?

Re: How fast is 12th Gen Intel Core?

#374

Post by BaseballPhysics »

jrockway wrote: post #370
BaseballPhysics wrote: post #323

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For a site about "hacker" news, this comment is wild to me. It seems we've truly reached the apex of disposable consumer culture, where even our most powerful technology is something we just throw in the trash and re-purchase when something fails or newer technology becomes available. I can only hope that companies like Framework can reverse some of this trend. Because as it stands, our already unsustainable culture…

I guess "stuff" isn't really the problem with the current society. If you write software for a living, the company that has a 50% faster hack/test/ship cycle is the one that wins the market. It is a shame that you have to throw away a power supply, keyboard, and screen every few years to get that faster cycle, and Framework helps there. But at the same time, the chips that Framework uses waste valuable electricity an…

> But at the same time, the chips that Framework uses waste valuable electricity

I pretty well guarantee you the small amount of energy saved by operating an M1 is more than made up for by the cost of manufacturing and shipping a new laptop every few years as part of the Apple replacement cycle.

> Recycling your laptop's screen every 5 years

You might want to do a little research about what's involved in upgrading a framework mainboard. Far far more than just the screen is "recycled" when upgrading a machine like that.

And that's ignoring the ability to reuse or resell components outside of the Framework chassis. I fully expect to turn my old mainboard into a server when the time comes to eventually upgrade it.

> It feels good to help in a small way, but what feels good is not necessarily meaningful.

This is a classic thought-killing argument intended to invalidate any kind of individual action or intervention. "Well, what little thing I do has no meaningful impact in the big picture, so why bother."

The answer to that is simple: Government needs to pass laws mandating right to repair. It's long past time that companies like Apple be forced to do the right thing, because it's clear they're not going to do it themselves, particularly when consumers have apparently convinced themselves that their individual choices don't matter.

Re: How fast is 12th Gen Intel Core?

#375

Post by deergomoo »

tfigment wrote: post #259
brailsafe wrote: post #200

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Out of curiosity, and aside from Teams which I'm already sadly familiar with, what software is it that you're talking about? Company I work for was just bought by some megacorp, but I'm still using my own 2019 13" MBP for now.

My company has some McAfee and Palo Alto stuff and the cyvera cloud backup software which scans every file every 4 hours but then triggers the other software because of access attempts. Some of these are suites so its 3-4 diferent things (firewall, dlp, antivirus, ...)

> Palo Alto stuff

Fuck this company, one of my wife’s jobs is BYOD but requires GlobalProtect for their VPN. After the software has been running for a few hours, even disconnected, it just starts chewing CPU cycles and grinds her M1 MacBook to a halt.

The only way to terminate it is via `defaults write` command in the terminal. It’s basically malware.

Re: How fast is 12th Gen Intel Core?

#376

Post by ceeplusplus »

riquito wrote: post #369
ceeplusplus wrote: post #357

Earlier quoted context omitted.

From your link: "Even under demanding multi-threaded workloads, the M2 MacBook Air was not nearly as warm as the other laptops tested" Keep in mind the 6850U you're comparing against has a fan too. Notebookcheck says it has a 40W turbo on the gen 2 model, and the gen 3 Intel version has a 28W sustained boost. An M2 uses around 20W. Also, a lot of those benchmarks are showing all x86 CPUs with a 3x+ lead, which indica…

You moved the discussion from performance to thermal/power very fast, guess you didn't like the benchmarks

If you want to talk benchmarks, you need to exclude all the ones where there is a clear software optimization problem.

Re: How fast is 12th Gen Intel Core?

#377

Post by CameronNemo »

inciampati wrote: post #173
microtonal wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

These numbers are usually lower in real life There are data sheets and then there is real life. People were raving about AMD laptops before. I got a ThinkPad T14 AMD with a 4750U. The stated psref battery life is MobileMark 2014: 14 hr, MobileMark 2018: 11.5 hr. In practice that was more like 7 hours on Windows (with a mild workload) and 3 hours on Linux. The CPU performance was merely ok and I could get the fans blo…

Within a year the kernel should support proper Power management on these new AMD systems. I have a year old 5800H that went from 3 hours to 11 hours battery life in typical use, just due to kernel version updates. It's like a new system.

It is such a shame that certain major distros don't ship latest kernels. I understand also shipping LTS kernels for customers/users that want the stability, but the default for desktops and install media should be a really recent kernel.

Re: How fast is 12th Gen Intel Core?

#378

Post by deaddodo »

ncmncm wrote: post #362
deaddodo wrote: post #299

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have a laptop with the AMD 6900HS. The CPU is great. It’s power envelope and performance feel amazing. My biggest complaint is the there is a very limited selection of Laptops with AMD’s chips, especially the top tier. The one I bought required me to replace the Wifi/Bluetooth card (it came with a barely “supported” MediaTek one) for Linux.

Razer 14"? Or Dell Alienware? Lenovo's is the only one I find with 16" 3840x2400 OLED, but just a 6850, $2800. Or with 6950 but just 1920x1200, $2635. None with both. Advantage, Radeon R6500M GPU. Doesn't say which wifi it has. https://www.lenovo.com/us/en/search?fq=&text=21D4000HUS Dell has a 17" 6900HX, 4k, 32G RAM, RX6850 GPU, $2800. Or 6800H and RX6700, $2550. Mediatek MT7921 wifi... https://www.dell.com/en-us/wo…

Zephyrus G14. I certainly wouldn’t swear off ASUS over it. After you upgrade the Wifi card (and, optionally, the SSD), it’s a great laptop; especially for Linux.

Re: How fast is 12th Gen Intel Core?

#379

Post by deaddodo »

siwyd wrote: post #328
deaddodo wrote: post #299

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have a laptop with the AMD 6900HS. The CPU is great. It’s power envelope and performance feel amazing. My biggest complaint is the there is a very limited selection of Laptops with AMD’s chips, especially the top tier. The one I bought required me to replace the Wifi/Bluetooth card (it came with a barely “supported” MediaTek one) for Linux.

Which one did you get? I was looking at Linux laptops with this CPU, but the line-up is very limited.

ASUS Zephyrus G14.

Re: How fast is 12th Gen Intel Core?

#380

Post by wtallis »

jvanderbot wrote: post #275
SpacePortKnight wrote: post #104

In a laptop, I care far more about battery life and the fan noise. However, Intel 12th gen is only able to pull these impressive performance feats due to very high turbo boost clocks. It's not that Intel is bad, it's still pretty great but in the age of M1 I wish Intel released a processor with similar power consumption. I use my Intel i5-1240p with turbo boost disabled when on battery. Here's the geekbench with TB d…

You can usually use the "Xtreme Tuning Utility" (by Intel) to scale down without disabling turbo boost. I use it to scale my ~4.8 Ghz cores to 3.2 Ghz, so they can run without fans on my small form factor PC. 3.2 Ghz x 8 is enough to run most my favorite games. Without TB, I'm down to 8x 2.4, which is a bit sluggish.

You may get better results by leaving the clock speed settings alone and adjusting the long-term power limits to an acceptable level. That way you won't sacrifice peak performance (ie. latency, especially with only one or two cores in use) but will still get most of the power savings.
Post reply on HN