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Cognitive decline linked to ultraprocessed food, study finds

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Re: Cognitive decline linked to ultraprocessed food, study finds

#101

Post by omginternets »

samatman wrote: post #93
omginternets wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a rule of thumb, friend. It actually does make a difference in the aggregate, as evidenced by the extra ingredients you will find in pre-processed supermarket meat. Have a look at what's in your hot dogs, for example. Obvious exceptions apply, such as going to the butcher, as you have astutely observed. These do not invalidate the rule-of-thumb.

The issue is rather that nothing in your rule-of-thumb works. Frozen corn vs whole corn? Were you planning to eat the cob? Does it help my diet to cut corn kernels off manually? How? Meat you have to cut? Maybe you're thinking hot dogs here, my first thought was ground beef. Does breaking out the meat grinder, and cleaning it, help me eat right? How? Fish you have to filet? Can I just buy the filets? Or is it 100% ne…

Yes, it requires some discernment, as do most rules-of-thumb. There is no algorithm, here.

Re: Cognitive decline linked to ultraprocessed food, study finds

#102

Post by kayodelycaon »

nobody9999 wrote: post #73
kayodelycaon wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t know anything how to cook anything from fresh ingredients that takes just 15 minutes from entering the kitchen to going to the table to eat. It takes 7 minutes for my kettle to bring 1.5 L of water to boil. (Yay 120v…) Instant oatmeal I guess? Anything requiring dairy or eggs won’t work.

>Anything requiring dairy or eggs won’t work. Is that because you're vegan, or because you think it takes a long time? I'll be having an omelette for dinner this evening and if it takes me more than 10 or so minutes to prepare, I'll be quite surprised.

I'm allergic to caesin or whey and I haven't figured out what is in eggs that makes me feel sick.

My diet is basically vegan + meat. (Easiest way to explain it.)

Re: Cognitive decline linked to ultraprocessed food, study finds

#103

Post by sotajensede »

garettmd wrote: post #31
lezojeda wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And tbh, it really does take time to prepare a good meal, including washing dishes and all that. For those of us living alone it takes a good chunk of our free time after work.

Not arguing with you that it takes a considerable amount of time to prepare and clean-up a home cooked meal. But as someone who is not living alone (have a wife and kids), I'd say you probably have a lot more free time than you think you do, and I'm not sure that cooking just for yourself takes up any more time than it would cooking more food, for more people with varying tastes, allergies, etc. Add to the fact that…

> I'd say you probably have a lot more free time than you think you do

Not to sound harsh, this is just how I frame these sorts of things for my own benefit: If you have free time and are getting takeout or eating hot pockets, you're just borrowing that time from the end of your lifespan to use between work and sleep. It's like borrowing from a 401k on a fixed income.

Speaking of, the same goes for finances. We feel like certain essentials are disproportionately expensive because we can otherwise afford previously unheard of luxuries on average incomes, but we are actually just much less wealthy than consumerism makes us feel.

So if we live wisely and with discipline, it is quickly obvious that time and money are in much shorter supply than most realize. That isn't necessarily grim, but this framing is much more useful in good habit forming in my experience.

The value culture in the West has so quickly changed in only a generation or two depending on the specific region, that I'm more suspicious over time of the perceived unobtainability of certain ways of living that we frequently romanticize.

Re: Cognitive decline linked to ultraprocessed food, study finds

#104

Post by ParksNet »

garettmd wrote: post #31
lezojeda wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And tbh, it really does take time to prepare a good meal, including washing dishes and all that. For those of us living alone it takes a good chunk of our free time after work.

Not arguing with you that it takes a considerable amount of time to prepare and clean-up a home cooked meal. But as someone who is not living alone (have a wife and kids), I'd say you probably have a lot more free time than you think you do, and I'm not sure that cooking just for yourself takes up any more time than it would cooking more food, for more people with varying tastes, allergies, etc. Add to the fact that…

Electric pressure cookers are the key to encouraging home cooking.

I just throw in Chicken Thighs, Rice, Frozen Vegetables. Add water. Set for 7 minutes. Come back to several servings of perfectly cooked food. Add things like peanut sauce and seasoning to taste before or after pressurization.

Total human involvement time to prep, monitor, and serve: about 5 minutes, ingredients are available at any Walmart. Electric pressure cookers are regularly on sale for $40 at Best Buy.

Cooking the same meal using pots and pans would take 60 minutes of human time and require many more pieces of equipment to buy, use and wash.

Give every poor household in the USA an electric pressure cooker, and the instructions on how to use them. Poor households wouldn't even need cooktops or ovens anymore.

Re: Cognitive decline linked to ultraprocessed food, study finds

#105

Post by justsomehnguy »

omginternets wrote: post #74
nonameiguess wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Non-instant oatmeal takes 5 minutes. Eggs 2 minutes (but fine if you won't eat them). Broiling a steak takes 6 minutes. Broiling a salmon filet takes 15 minutes. A single serving of rice in a saucepan takes about 15 minutes. Steaming or sauteeing vegetables takes about 10 minutes, plus a few more to chop them up at the start (though not the insane time to dice tomatoes or onions). Boiling and mashing potatoes takes a…

Adding to this (excellent) summary: - Buy the best ingredients you can - Taste and smell as you go - Don't overcook Following these three rules will allow for culinary experimentation, while avoiding disaster. Final bit of advice: enjoy it. It's fun to make something delicious, especially after a hard day full of "emotional labor" and whatnot.

> Final bit of advice

Don't be afraid to fail. The worst what can be is what you would wait for a pizza delivery while you are scrubbing pots.

No snapshots and backups there!

Re: Cognitive decline linked to ultraprocessed food, study finds

#106

Post by nobody9999 »

kayodelycaon wrote: post #102
nobody9999 wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Anything requiring dairy or eggs won’t work. Is that because you're vegan, or because you think it takes a long time? I'll be having an omelette for dinner this evening and if it takes me more than 10 or so minutes to prepare, I'll be quite surprised.

I'm allergic to caesin or whey and I haven't figured out what is in eggs that makes me feel sick. My diet is basically vegan + meat. (Easiest way to explain it.)

I'm sorry. I imagine that limits you in many ways, since dairy and eggs are ubiquitous in western cooking.

Stir-fry meat and vegetables can be quite tasty and quick to prepare.

Something like mustard greens or gai lan[0] can be shredded by hand in a few moments and/or cut up almost as quickly.

Mushrooms (whole if you're in a rush, or sliced -- that only takes a minute or so), tofu (i prefer firm tofu), are also quite nice for such a dish.

And you can grill your meat/fish/poultry and saute your vegetables too.

Fresh fruit is also quite tasty.

I guess my point is that one can make tasty, healthful food quickly and easily, even if you have dietary restrictions.

In fact, those with dietary restrictions are likely better off cooking than eating prepared/pre-processed foods, as you don't have any insight/control over the kitchen/factory in which those foods are prepared.

Not telling you what to do, just sharing my experiences. I hope you find them useful.

[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gai_lan

Re: Cognitive decline linked to ultraprocessed food, study finds

#107

Post by jjulius »

cortesoft wrote: post #85
jjulius wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not as easy as "going to bed hungry". It requires work by parents to provide a positive environment when it comes to food - never giving certain foods a stigma, not putting pressure on them to "eat their vegetables", never reminding them what they like or don't like, always making meals positive, letting them choose what to eat, etc.. The concept is, I believe, called "baby-led weaning"; my wife discovered it an…

While your suggestions about how to treat food as to not create issues down the road are correct, I still think you are attributing too much power to parents. Everyone wants to believe that if you just do these certain things, then your kids will turn out a certain way. That just isn't true; while a parent can help shift some things, a lot of things are just about how a particular kid is. Some kids are just more pick…

I never said that any kind of parenting method is guaranteed to achieve the results you want. My kids still aren't into certain foods and won't eat them, but it's not like they actively hate those foods, and I'm not setting thems up for avoiding those foods entirely in the future. It's a general concept that I am sure we will find ourselves employing throughout their lives, even as adults - build and maintain a strong foundation upon which they can grow on their terms.

The crux of my point was to highlight that parenting is never as simplistic as the previous comment ("All ya have to do is tell them to eat or go hungry!") may have made it sound, not to suggest that you can mold your children exactly as you would like.

Edit: And your point about some kids being pickier than others is actually exactly my point. That's why I said it's not easy - it has taken a lot of time and patience for us to get our children to this point. I've heard stories of parents struggling for over a year or more to get a kid to break certain eating habits. It's not just picky eating, though - correcting various aspects of a child's personality requires a LOT of time and attention, often over the course of years. That's why I took an issue with OP brushing it off so casually.

Re: Cognitive decline linked to ultraprocessed food, study finds

#109

Post by prewett »

vkk8 wrote: post #27
omarhaneef wrote: post #8

I wish I knew what was ultraprocessed. > "Ultraprocessed foods are defined as "industrial formulations of food substances (oils, fats, sugars, starch, and protein isolates) that contain little or no whole foods and typically include flavorings, colorings, emulsifiers, and other cosmetic additives," according to the study. But if I have a package that says it is whole grain or whatever, how do I know if it is or isn't…

Indeed. I hate the term "ultraprocessed" so much, because I have no idea what to look for if I try to avoid it. If I chop my potatoes before boiling them, is that processing? If not, which steps in cooking count as "processing"? And how many of those steps need to be included for the food to be "ultraprocessed"? How can I avoid accidentally "ultraprocessing" my food when I cook it at home?

The definition I heard (apparently by the Brazilian woman that did the first research) was "any ingredient that wouldn't be found in a regular kitchen". Not meaning things like rutabagas or mangosteen, but rather things like xantham gum, soy lecithin, and things with organic chemical names. So by definition you cannot ultra-process your food in your home kitchen.

I think the name is lousy, but I think the reason is that things like xantham gum and soy lecithin are there to provide texture. For example, low-fat yogurt has some of these in it because if you take the fat out, it doesn't have the same texture (probably isn't even solid), so you need to do some processing to get it to the same place. See [1] for a summary.

There's a podcast on the BBC where a doctor tries to get his twin doctor brother of ultra-processed food. Unfortunately, most of the episodes involve emotional issues, but they do have a few minutes of interviews with major researchers. [3] is sort of a summary.

[1] https://www.bbc.co.uk/food/articles/what_is_ultra-processed_...

[2] https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/m0017tcz/episodes/player

[3] https://www.bbc.co.uk/food/articles/van_tulleken

Re: Cognitive decline linked to ultraprocessed food, study finds

#110

Post by justsomehnguy »

picture wrote: post #26
omginternets wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nah. I work long hours and still find time to cook. Dinner takes about 15 mins to prepare, on average. I think the issue has more to do with people not knowing how to cook things that are both simple and nutritious. I really feel for people who are trying to learn; every beginner's cookbook is full of things that require specific ingredients, complicated prep work, or a shit-ton of chopping. I've toyed around with th…

Have you come across any good (or, better ,) cookbooks or resources for simple and nutritious food? I'm about to go to college so it would be a great help

> I'm about to go to college

You don't even need a cookbook, just take your time to learn how to use a frying pan and basic boiling in a pot skill.

Eg:

Plain pasta - cheap, extreamly energy dense, soggy if you overcook or don't use enough water (1L/100g dry w.)

Now chop the onion, saute until it's ready, drop the [the timed to cook, it's hard first three times] pasta in it for a 15-30 secs. BAM, a whole different meal.

Now the same, but add a grated carrots. BAM, a whole different meal.

The same but add tomatos OR tomate paste: BAM, whole two new meals.

Now replace pasta with a boiled or fried potatoes: BAM, 8 more meals.

Replace/add frozen vegetables - BAM... well, you know, more meals.

Just learn how to time, not using American anounts of oil and when it is time to get the pan or pot of the heat.

And no, no plastic anything IN the oven.

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