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Tell HN: Apple Pay works in non-Safari browsers in iOS 16 Beta 3

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Re: Tell HN: Apple Pay works in non-Safari browsers in iOS 16 Beta 3

#61

Post by jefftk »

solarkraft wrote: post #44
samwillis wrote: post #29

This is good news, I hope they make it available in all “In App Browsers” (IABs) too, along with all saved payment cards in your key chain. As a data point from an online retailer, we kept seeing a significantly high (I think it was something ridiculous like 30%) drop out at the check out payment screen for all Facebook/Instagram ad customers. What was happening was they were clicking on ads, coming to our site, goin…

> The in app browsers have an “open in Safari” button, they were clicking that - so they could use their prefers payment method - and loosing their session and shopping cart. It was catastrophic! This is one of the few instances in which Android went to some lengths to provide a good UX. An IAB can transition into the real thing without even re-rendering or blinking - and it has all the user data of the main browser.

That's not quite right. A real in-app browser on Android, like Facebook's, has fully independent state. But Android also supports a feature called Custom Tabs, where you can have something that looks an acts a lot like an in-app browser but is actually your default browser under the hood. The embedding app gives up some control over it, and can't for example, inject custom JavaScript, but in exchange it shares state with the default browser.

More: https://developer.chrome.com/docs/android/custom-tabs/

Re: Tell HN: Apple Pay works in non-Safari browsers in iOS 16 Beta 3

#63

Post by jefftk »

pmontra wrote: post #26
MBCook wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Everything is still Safari underneath. That’s probably never changing as long as Apple has a say (that new EU law may force it). But this would mean you could use ApplePay from the current FireFox app.

Letting all browsers with a Safari engine use all the features of Safari-Safari fed be a way to nudge users to keep using Safari browsers instead of other browser engines, when that EU law forces Apple to open up the platform. The other browsers could be forever behind is iOS features. However that's going to make the browser experience closer to native.

I'm glad Apple is opening up features for other browsers to use on iOS, but I don't understand how this nudges users? As soon as it is permitted, Firefox, Chrome, etc will switch from their WebKit based implementations to using their own engines.

Re: Tell HN: Apple Pay works in non-Safari browsers in iOS 16 Beta 3

#64

Post by jefftk »

madeofpalk wrote: post #59
tomxor wrote: post #19

No it doesn't, because there is no such thing as a non-safari browser on iOS. Firefox, Chrome, anything Apple will allow is just Safari in a different costume.

Brave and Edge is not Chrome.

Brave and Edge can compile the Chromium code base with any changes they want, including adding or removing features. On iOS that is not something alternative browsers are able to do.

Re: Tell HN: Apple Pay works in non-Safari browsers in iOS 16 Beta 3

#65

Post by tomxor »

madeofpalk wrote: post #59
tomxor wrote: post #19

No it doesn't, because there is no such thing as a non-safari browser on iOS. Firefox, Chrome, anything Apple will allow is just Safari in a different costume.

Brave and Edge is not Chrome.

it doesn't matter what it's called, the underlying engine of any "browser" app available on iOS is apple-webkit. Because you aren't allowed browser engines on iOS, Apple rules, it's all a bunch of skins. Apple are so good at selling the lie of diversity that hardly anyone seems to notice this seemingly obvious truth... you aren't allowed to chose a browser on iOS.

Re: Tell HN: Apple Pay works in non-Safari browsers in iOS 16 Beta 3

#66

Post by rjh29 »

thehappypm wrote: post #33
sandstrom wrote: post #25

Probably preparations due to the upcoming EU framework. As a short summary, here are some of the new EU requirements on gatekeepers such as Apple. Gatekeepers must: - Allow users to install apps from third-party app stores and sideload directly from the internet. - Allow developers to offer third-party payment systems in apps and promote offers outside the gatekeeper's platforms. - Allow developers to integrate their…

I hate that you cant sideload today but its gonna lead to tons of malware

Does Android have a malware problem with sideloading? The majority of users don't know how to sideload and don't do it. Technical users hopefully know what they're doing. In any event, if you google "android malware" most of the results are apps that slipped into the app store:

https://www.tomsguide.com/news/malware-hits-10-million-andro...

Re: Tell HN: Apple Pay works in non-Safari browsers in iOS 16 Beta 3

#67

Post by GeekyBear »

jefftk wrote: post #57
GeekyBear wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's about 100% more likely that it's going lead to every company that chafes under Apple's current "you have to ask permission before you can do that" rules to begin to only offer their apps outside the App Store. Remember the original Android permission model of "an app gets every permission it wants or you can't install it"? That's where this is heading.

I would think a permissions model is something that Apple would still be able to design and enforce through their control of the operating system?

The same way that Google prevents malware from existing outside of the Google Play Store?

Re: Tell HN: Apple Pay works in non-Safari browsers in iOS 16 Beta 3

#68

Post by throwaway821909 »

jefftk wrote: post #60
dawiddr wrote: post #24

Apple Pay has been supported in WebKit’s web view (which every browser uses) for a while now, but with some conditions. The biggest obstacle was that an app couldn’t inject any JavaScript code of its own into websites. I wonder if they removed this safeguard.

They must have removed that: if you're building your own browser you definitely want to be able to inject JavaScript code, because one of your few options for differentiating yourself on iOS is supporting browser features that Apple hasn't prioritized implementing yet. Both Chrome and Firefox do this by injecting polyfills.

You're probably right but it's not like Apple wouldn't take the chance to kill that off if they thought they could get away with it

Re: Tell HN: Apple Pay works in non-Safari browsers in iOS 16 Beta 3

#69

Post by DelightOne »

sandstrom wrote: post #25

Probably preparations due to the upcoming EU framework. As a short summary, here are some of the new EU requirements on gatekeepers such as Apple. Gatekeepers must: - Allow users to install apps from third-party app stores and sideload directly from the internet. - Allow developers to offer third-party payment systems in apps and promote offers outside the gatekeeper's platforms. - Allow developers to integrate their…

> Allow users to install apps from third-party app stores and sideload directly from the internet.

Do third-party app stores have to pay fees to Apple for each purchase? Can they change the rate from the current 30%? That's what I'm wondering about.

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