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Huanan Seafood Market in Wuhan was early epicenter of the Covid-19 pandemic

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Re: Huanan Seafood Market in Wuhan was early epicenter of the Covid-19 pandemic

#121

Post by dang »

stinkass wrote: post #93
hammock wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That is exactly what pfas manufacturers like 3M and others are doing to gaslight residents of towns all over America, right now

I met a nurse that said one of her family members lived in a small housing development where almost everyone got terminal brain cancer. A certain company that you've heard of handled hazardous materials next door and offered to do the testing in the development. Surprise, no contamination found. And they made it clear that if you implicate them, you'll be contacted by their sizable legal department. Everyone affected…

(This is is unrelated to your comment, just the username)

Trollish usernames aren't allowed on HN because they effectively troll every thread they post to.

We've learned that it's better to deal with this earlier than later, so I've banned the account. Happy to rename and unban it if you want to pick a more neutral username.

This is a borderline case—we don't want to be prudes—but I suspect most readers would rather not have "stinkass" in their face.

https://hn.algolia.com/?sort=byDate&dateRange=all&type=comme...

Re: Huanan Seafood Market in Wuhan was early epicenter of the Covid-19 pandemic

#122

Post by systemvoltage »

mikeyouse wrote: post #85
systemvoltage wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

OTOH, complete submission to scientific sources without checking the details seems exactly opposite of how science should work. HN is probably overly scientific in this sense.

Nobody is "checking the details" in this thread - they're just wildly speculating based on their feelings and asserting that the absence of evidence about the virus originating at the WIV is very clearly suspicious...

Speaking generally, every single time a new study is discussed on HN, the first comment talks about how it doesn't do what it is supposed to. For e.g., a topic about "X cures cancer" has a comment that's at the very top that claims "No, X doesn't cure cancer, except in these narrow cases" and then sources the details in the paper.

That seems to me the right thing to do. HN does that very well.

Re: Huanan Seafood Market in Wuhan was early epicenter of the Covid-19 pandemic

#123

Post by HPsquared »

pipeline_peak wrote: post #74
HPsquared wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

1960s America led to 1970s America, which had a lot more concern for the environment. It's inevitable that as problems accumulate, people affected by them will want to do something about it.

1970's America wasn't anywhere near as poverty struck as China. It's really difficult to care about the world around you when you can't even take care at home.

The country has enough wealth.

In 1975 the US GDP was about $7500/yr per capita (in 2021 dollars). Today the Chinese GDP per capita is around $10k/yr (more like 19k accounting for purchasing power parity).

Re: Huanan Seafood Market in Wuhan was early epicenter of the Covid-19 pandemic

#124

Post by sudosysgen »

noworriesnate wrote: post #105
sudosysgen wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is far fetched. Labs typically engage in destructive testing of their animals.

This lab was a joint venture of the French and Chinese. The French pulled out and sounded the alarm about how careless the Chinese were. So yeah it’s very plausible that such flagrant violations took place.

It's not about violations. The animals are killed because the nature of the data taken from them requires them not to be alive.

Re: Huanan Seafood Market in Wuhan was early epicenter of the Covid-19 pandemic

#125

Post by pipeline_peak »

HPsquared wrote: post #123
pipeline_peak wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

1970's America wasn't anywhere near as poverty struck as China. It's really difficult to care about the world around you when you can't even take care at home.

The country has enough wealth. In 1975 the US GDP was about $7500/yr per capita (in 2021 dollars). Today the Chinese GDP per capita is around $10k/yr (more like 19k accounting for purchasing power parity).

How's the quality of life for the average citizen, accessible modern medical treatment across the country?

You can pull all the numbers you want, but you can't steer from the fact that it's an impoverished shithole.

Re: Huanan Seafood Market in Wuhan was early epicenter of the Covid-19 pandemic

#126

Post by anigbrowl »

mgamache wrote: post #48
mikeyouse wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nope - HN is one of the worst 'smart' places on the internet for Covid discussion. Every single thread immediately devolves into completely ascientific conspiracy ranting.

Labeling something as 'conspiracy ranting' is convenient low-brow tactic to dismiss a supported point of view without consideration. This is also a pattern on HN.

What has been asserted without evidence may be dismissed without evidence.

Re: Huanan Seafood Market in Wuhan was early epicenter of the Covid-19 pandemic

#127

Post by onlyrealcuzzo »

rmetzler wrote: post #97
onlyrealcuzzo wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You find it more believable that it somehow made sense to sell animals infected with viruses for human consumption than someone made a mistake and got infected with a virus they were doing experiments on?

The Wuhan lab used to catch wild bats and take virus samples from them. It’s not too far fetched someone sold the same bats to the market or was infected and infected other people / living animals there.

I still don't see why you think researches would resort to selling bats to a wet market to make a little extra money.

They'd be fired for sure if caught.

They also would make almost no extra money... The going rate for bats isn't much...

Re: Huanan Seafood Market in Wuhan was early epicenter of the Covid-19 pandemic

#129

Post by ChemSpider »

anigbrowl wrote: post #119
ejb999 wrote: post #36

I wonder how many people who are seemingly willing to believe the self-serving CCP party-line on this, would be just as believing of the owners of a nuclear power plant in their town, once the drinking water became radioactive, claiming "it didn't come from the plant, someone else down the street must have done it" - that is just about as believable as this.

Pure emotional argument without substance. You made no effort at all to criticize the methodology (which looks pretty standard to me, consistent with methods used to pinpoint the origin of other disease outbreaks besides COVID), or the raw data. Not one of the listed authors is Chinese, nor do any of them have any Chinese institutional affiliations. What is your actual argument for why I should disregard this, beyond…

The authors of this paper might well be honest and smart, but they - as we all - have to rely on raw data provided by China.

Re: Huanan Seafood Market in Wuhan was early epicenter of the Covid-19 pandemic

#130

Post by mikeyouse »

onetimepasswd wrote: post #50
CWuestefeld wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The two are not mutually exclusive. For example, some "theories" say that a WIV employee took animals that had been used in experiments, and sold them at the market. I'm not suggesting this is actually what happened, just that there's plenty of room for involvement from both of these entities (or, perhaps, neither).

I think a more likely lab leak via market theory is that an employee was exposed and then exposed others at the market. As I remember the market is between the lab and some public transit destinations. It would make sense to go through the market on the way home from work.

> As I remember the market is between the lab and some public transit destinations. It would make sense to go through the market on the way home from work.

You don't remember correctly. The WIV is ~15km from the market and there are multiple other markets nearer the WIV if employees were regularly 'shopping.

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