Live data from Hacker News

Don’t Blame Dostoyevsky

theatlantic.com

111–120 of 251 posts

Re: Don’t Blame Dostoyevsky

#111
post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That book might have been relevent in 2005 but throw it out the window now. All anti-Russian sentiment in the world is due to the fact Russia is literally engaging in genocide against Ukrainians, right now.

Are you suggesting that bigotry is now okay towards all Russians?

No post body was provided.

Re: Don’t Blame Dostoyevsky

#112
post #100

If you're interested in some constructive arguments why this article is wrong, please see a thread: https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1516162437455654913.html

I love Galeev threads - but he is sometimes a bit slopy. In this tread the quote "Submit, Cherkes! Both West and East, May soon share your fate, When the time comes, you'll say arrogantly: Yes, I'm a slave but a slave of the Tsar of the World!" he attributes to Pushkin is from "Ismail Bey" by Lermontov.

I nod along with a lot of the things he says, but only because I’m already deeply familiar with them. I think for someone less familiar it’s easy to get an illusion of learning, as he frequently exaggerates to make a point and makes some basic mistakes here and there.

Re: Don’t Blame Dostoyevsky

#113
post #3

crazy that the case even need be made. Says a lot about where we are, and - how quickly we got there

Do you consider it crazy to think authors can influence culture?

I consider it crazy that there is talk about banning literary classics

Re: Don’t Blame Dostoyevsky

#114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm going to challenge this because I think it suggests that reading the Russian classics is an intellectual challenge with a perquisite of studying Russian history and culture. Dostoyevsky's works are amazing without any background knowledge. No 'intellectualism' is required, just a love of stories. With a few tweaks they could be set in a modern era and turned into Netflex series. War and Peace is considered a chal…

I don't think there was an inference that the books are opaque, just that people reading these books in 2022 are already weird ducks. Well, as weird as anyone reading, say, Tao Te Ching or other non-standard-academic-curriculum "classic" books you'd have to go out of your way to read.

Anna Karenina was an Oprah book club selection. War and Peace occasionally pops up on bestseller lists.

Re: Don’t Blame Dostoyevsky

#115
post #86
post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Take a beloved in the West author like Solzhenitsyn, whose "compassion" suddenly evaporates when Ukrainian question is raised. Solzhenitsin is one of the best literary chroniclers of repressions in the Soviet Russia (One Day in the Life of Ivan Denisovich, The Gulag Archipelago, In the First Circle), with the degree of earnestness and realism that approaches Tolstoy's. How does his compassion to Ukranians, or lack…

I think the point OP was trying to make was that due to A.S. demonstrated disdain for the Ukrainians his books deserve a boycot. Cant disagree more. To understand modern day Russia one needs to have read Solzchenitsyn's books. The country today is a product of decades of strong negative selection favouring the immoral and strongly discouraging moral acts. Those who live in Moscow and make up the modern Russia are the…

> Cant disagree more.

Me too :-) I don't accept anyone's authority to tell me what I should or shouldn't read (watch, listen to, etc.); and I wonder at anyone who would.

However, I couldn't help noticing that the vocabulary of your comment ("negative selection", "descendants") was rather biological. As I am sure you know, it isn't just the Moscovites who have navigated their way through the communist times, but the populations of the former Soviet republics as well. I also think I won't be too far off the mark if I say that superficial social adaptations or morality aren't hereditary, and people are very malleable creatures.

Re: Don’t Blame Dostoyevsky

#116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This makes me wonder, is it possible that the pool of solutions available to Russia's leaders is objectively limited due to Russia's geopolitical and sociopolitical realities and they really don't have too much of a rational choice?

That's a point that deserves deeper study. They have (from memory) 13 countries on their borders, and almost no "natural" borders, e.g. rivers or mountain ranges. They have a history that's blood-curdling. Expecting a new czar to make it like Denmark is a bit much. The West tried in the 90s, and Boris Yeltsin is not remembered fondly over there. The emergence of gangster capitalism was the result.

> They have (from memory) 13 countries on their borders

they have all of them on one side (Western border), and majority of these countries are small and weak. Comparing to Germany, which is surrounded by potential enemies (I am talking about pre WW2 time), Russia had significant advantage.

Re: Don’t Blame Dostoyevsky

#117
post #29

I think it’s important to understand that russian culture has failed. If it can’t guide a nation towards humanistic values, what is a culture’s point?

To survive? I don’t think cultures have points. They survive or die, and it’s a bit strange to use a specific cultural value as a measure of success of all other cultures.

Re: Don’t Blame Dostoyevsky

#118
post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m quite certain a very similar article could be written about, say, UK and Ireland with quotes from famous authors. It’s not that the English lack an imperialist past and feelings of superiority.

If UK will take weapons and go on a killing spree to “restore the great empire”, I’m gonna boycott them just as much.

Be just in your quest for justice. If the UK goes on a killing spree to restore the empire, that has zero to do with Shakespeare or Milton. Don't blame the centuries-dead guys for the current generation's going genocidal.

Sure, there may be plenty to boycott. Boycott anyone who supports the genocidal regime. The dead ones didn't get a say, though.

Re: Don’t Blame Dostoyevsky

#119
post #94
post #13

A Ukrainian here - couldn't disagree more with the author. Take a beloved in the West author like Solzhenitsyn, whose "compassion" suddenly evaporates when Ukrainian question is raised. Even a modern sci-fi author Sergei Lukyanenko does not shy away from racial jokes against Ukrainians or Lithuanians in his Dozor books. Ukraine is a pawn at the world stage, but if the West is serious about battling russia (for its ow…

If ordinary Russians look out at the world and perceive that they and their culture are despised and hated, they'll rally around their xenophobic leader. If Russians look out at the world and see a consensus that their leader has impoverished their nation for his personal benefit, they'll be more likely to question his motives. Ukraine's best shot at winning the war is for Putin to lose the support of Russian soldier…

I guess culture shouldn't be canceled so people can figure out how things actually work. The only thing that will make the populace question Putin is if he looses the war.

Re: Don’t Blame Dostoyevsky

#120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you consider it crazy to think authors can influence culture?

I consider it crazy that there is talk about banning literary classics

Who is talking about banning? The question discussed in the article is whether we may blame Russian authors.

It is possible to be critical towards the philosophy of some litterature without banning it.

Post reply on HN