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Twitter Layoff Started Today

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Re: Twitter Layoff Started Today

#241

Post by HWR_14 »

stocknoob wrote: post #2

“ many of these folks won’t be able to sell the shares they earned. The money they need pay bills and keep them afloat if and until they get new employment. When severance ends, that’s it.” It’s Twitter’s responsibility to not only offer severance, but make sure employees keep an emergency fund?

I mean, Twitter is keeping them from liquidating the shares that they already own and have vested. It's easy to imagine that keeping savings in shares of a company as opposed to cash is reasonable.

How screwed would most people be if the stock exchanges all closed down and they were fired?

Re: Twitter Layoff Started Today

#242

Post by saagarjha »

thrown321 wrote: post #224
sokoloff wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most of these anti-insider trading policies prevent all of the obvious "one clever tricks" by prohibiting entering into options contracts, lending, borrowing, shorting, executing futures transactions, etc. If you could find someone to lend you cash (based on the totality of your financial situation and personal credit), that's fine. It's not fine to borrow someone else's shares and short them during a blackout.

Regular folks are not insiders. You can certainly pledge collateral for a loan.

I don’t recall what the terms were for TWTR but I do know my current employer prohibits using these shares as collateral for a loan, because you may default and be forced to sell them in the blackout period.

Re: Twitter Layoff Started Today

#243

Post by HWR_14 »

jonas21 wrote: post #178
onion2k wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Someone who earned 150k cash and 50k stock might be able to save, but they'd probably just keep their stock as their "emergency fund". Twitter are blocking them selling that stock. Effectively Twitter are laying people off and putting a freeze on their savings account. I think it's reasonable to have a little sympathy for people in that situation.

This sounds like the standard blackout period that public companies have every quarter to prevent insider trading. If so, it'll be lifted a few days after TWTR reports Q2 earnings later this month.

It's been in place for 38 days so far.

Re: Twitter Layoff Started Today

#244

Post by manyfriends »

ChrisLomont wrote: post #220
gwerbret wrote: post #200

> So- in addition to losing their jobs, which Twitter assured employees would not happen I'm not that old, but even I remember a time when companies, at least in principle, would invest in their employees (via stable employment, regular raises, mutual trust) in return for employees investing in the companies (innovation, extra effort, dedication, championing the company brand). Today, we have this: - Companies using…

>even I remember a time when companies, at least in principle, would invest in their employees (via stable employment, regular raises, mutual trust) in return for employees investing in the companies (innovation, extra effort, dedication, championing the company brand). Has there ever been really any difference? I know rose colored glasses make people think times past were better in many cases, but I find no evidence…

> Unions often drive out workers at the benefit of those getting union jobs, lowering employment. For example, see [5] and similar papers.

This seems a bit misleading from the article you referenced:

“The researchers find that, for both men and women, more union involvement in wage setting significantly decreases the employment rate of young and older individuals relative to the prime-aged group (with no significant effects on the relative unemployment of these groups). In contrast, a larger role for unions has little impact on male-female employment rate differentials but raises female unemployment relative to male unemployment.”

Lower employment for the very young and very old is generally a good thing in places with a robust welfare state —- and certainly is overshadowed by the positives of unions, such as the lower rates of poverty, lower mortality and accident rates, and higher job satisfaction and overall wages as a percentage of productivity across many industries.

Re: Twitter Layoff Started Today

#245

Post by HWR_14 »

rconti wrote: post #74
onion2k wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That isn't how it works unfortunately. If the shares vest during the blackout period they're only released to the employee, or former employee, once the blackout ends. The employees can't sell these until the blackout is lifted. Currently there is no end date set.

So this would only be an issue if they had no savings and had turned+burned all of their RSUs each pay period? (or, to be more charitable, just hit their 1 year cliff).

I think it's an issue if they had RSUs accumulated over N years and had not moved them to their brokerage account.

Re: Twitter Layoff Started Today

#246

Post by ev1 »

stocknoob wrote: post #113
falcolas wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Let's pretend some of these SF twitter employees have families. $4k in rent monthly, 4k in general living expenses (these are based off median figures available publicly) A bit over $96k in living costs. Assuming that $200k in total comp includes about 25% in stock (based off publicly reported comp packages for twitter employees), and a combined state/federal 35% tax rate... They have no spare money to save without a…

Yes, because income tax brackets aren’t progressive (all the income is taxed at 35%, and no standard deduction). People should definitely live a lifestyle with no slack for savings. It’s fault I couldn’t save anything with 3.5x the median household income.

150k is the actual housing and urban development definition of low income in San Francisco. You practically need assistance at that point.

Re: Twitter Layoff Started Today

#247

Post by WalterBright »

gwerbret wrote: post #200

> So- in addition to losing their jobs, which Twitter assured employees would not happen I'm not that old, but even I remember a time when companies, at least in principle, would invest in their employees (via stable employment, regular raises, mutual trust) in return for employees investing in the companies (innovation, extra effort, dedication, championing the company brand). Today, we have this: - Companies using…

> Companies literally escorting laid-off employees out of the building like criminals, on the premise that a suddenly-former employee is an incipient criminal.

It doesn't take many incipient criminals to ruin things for everyone. You'd do it to if you've ever had an employee steal or embezzle from you, and it's a lot more common than you might think.

Re: Twitter Layoff Started Today

#248

Post by HWR_14 »

cecilpl2 wrote: post #237
xienze wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If someone cant accumulate roughly 15% of their annual compensation in savings, while earning $200-400k/yr, then I have no idea what else could be done here to help. The thing with those crazy Valley salaries that you hear about here is that a lot of the time a good amount is in the form of stock that vests on a rolling basis. So maybe you get $150K in cash and $75K in stock. After 401k, California and federal taxe…

> The thing with those crazy Valley salaries that you hear about here is that a lot of the time a good amount is in the form of stock that vests on a rolling basis. This doesn't make any sense. Yes, your stock "vests on a rolling basis" the same way your salary "vests" every two weeks. If you are making 150k in cash and 75k in stock, then you get access to 225k (minus tax) of liquid cash every year. The vesting sched…

Unless you believed in TWTR and kept your stock as stock. Now it's locked up and you cannot access it.

Re: Twitter Layoff Started Today

#249

Post by dmix »

HWR_14 wrote: post #241
stocknoob wrote: post #2

“ many of these folks won’t be able to sell the shares they earned. The money they need pay bills and keep them afloat if and until they get new employment. When severance ends, that’s it.” It’s Twitter’s responsibility to not only offer severance, but make sure employees keep an emergency fund?

I mean, Twitter is keeping them from liquidating the shares that they already own and have vested. It's easy to imagine that keeping savings in shares of a company as opposed to cash is reasonable. How screwed would most people be if the stock exchanges all closed down and they were fired?

That's a good point and I'm sympathetic but this seems to be an exceptionally rare scenario. Not many companies are in an extended stock-buyout phase by a private entity.

Re: Twitter Layoff Started Today

#250

Post by thrown321 »

abeppu wrote: post #236
thrown321 wrote: post #229

Earlier quoted context omitted.

h1binfo will capture prevailing wages.

In the same spirit of "we can actually look at this stuff", I have to point out that: - I think in general _recruiters_ are not on H1Bs. And even for jobs held by people who _are_ on H1Bs, that can be a biased data source for salaries. - And sure enough of the info for twitter H1Bs, I see no recruiters. Plenty of engineers, a bunch of data scientists, some managers and directors, but no recruiters. https://h1bdata.in…

Lots of HR roles in there which is usually where recruiters are positioned. Unless you are saying all twitter recruiters on payroll are US citizens or permanent residents. Be sure to search all years.
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