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Belief in AI sentience is becoming a problem

reuters.com

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Re: Belief in AI sentience is becoming a problem

#61

Post by drpyser22 »

TMWNN wrote: post #38
cameronh90 wrote: post #8

I don't think LaMDA (or any other AI) is conscious or sentient. However, how will we be able to recognise it when we do create something that could be considered sentient? It seems inevitable that we will at some point. Many of the arguments used to suggest AI isn't sentient seem reductive, for example saying it's just a complex algorithm or statistical system. You could similarly say human brains are just a bunch of…

>However, how will we be able to recognise it when we do create something that could be considered sentient? It seems inevitable that we will at some point. >Many of the arguments used to suggest AI isn't sentient seem reductive, for example saying it's just a complex algorithm or statistical system. You could similarly say human brains are just a bunch of neurons firing in sequence to emulate sentience. Yes, this is…

They would obviously be wrong, because there's nothing truly general about those AI systems.

The goalposts move because we are naive about what is required for true general intelligence. Complex problems that seem to require complex intelligence sometimes turn out to be solvable through simpler systems. And sometimes we underestimate the complexity of a task and the intelligence required (such as autonomous driving).

Re: Belief in AI sentience is becoming a problem

#62

Post by drpyser22 »

AnIdiotOnTheNet wrote: post #24
htrp wrote: post #18

The key problem is not the belief in sentience but the hysteria and potential knee jerk reactions that widespread adoption of this belief may cause. Can you imagine if laws were passed affording algorithms "human rights" or regulations created to ensure that your fancy machine learning recommender system did not pass a certain "sentience threshold"?

I don't think that would be that bad a thing. Far better than the alternative of not having any laws and realizing far too late that we have been callously abusing a sentient being.

Is there a way to reliably measure sentience meaningfully?

Re: Belief in AI sentience is becoming a problem

#63

Post by williamcotton »

yreg wrote: post #26
cameronh90 wrote: post #8

I don't think LaMDA (or any other AI) is conscious or sentient. However, how will we be able to recognise it when we do create something that could be considered sentient? It seems inevitable that we will at some point. Many of the arguments used to suggest AI isn't sentient seem reductive, for example saying it's just a complex algorithm or statistical system. You could similarly say human brains are just a bunch of…

>It seems inevitable that we will at some point. We have no idea what causes consciousness. The only thing I'm sure about is that I'm conscious. Are all the other people conscious? I strongly believe so, but I don't have a proof. Are all the animals conscious? I think that they are, to different degrees. Would a simulation of full human brain on a computer be conscious? Uhh, I guess so? Would the same simulation, but…

I have a hunch that consciousness is at least dependent on autonomous interaction with an environment.

Re: Belief in AI sentience is becoming a problem

#64

Post by yreg »

hprotagonist wrote: post #5

"On two occasions I have been asked [by members of Parliament], 'Pray, Mr. Babbage, if you put into the machine wrong figures, will the right answers come out?' I am not able rightly to apprehend the kind of confusion of ideas that could provoke such a question." Passages from the Life of a Philosopher (London 1864)

A week ago we've had a thread here on the topic of how many of us are still amazed about imagen/dalle, but when we show it to our non-tech friends they are unphased.

This is why.

Re: Belief in AI sentience is becoming a problem

#65

Post by dqpb »

cameronh90 wrote: post #8

I don't think LaMDA (or any other AI) is conscious or sentient. However, how will we be able to recognise it when we do create something that could be considered sentient? It seems inevitable that we will at some point. Many of the arguments used to suggest AI isn't sentient seem reductive, for example saying it's just a complex algorithm or statistical system. You could similarly say human brains are just a bunch of…

> I don't think LaMDA (or any other AI) is conscious or sentient.

Neither do I, but it would be easy to blur the line more than they have.

Make it stateful, tick it at 30fps, and give it access to a persistent environment it can observe and explore.

If you can ask it “what did you do today?” and it can give you a real answer, then we can start asking the interesting questions about what’s missing.

Re: Belief in AI sentience is becoming a problem

#66

Post by mirceal »

cameronh90 wrote: post #8

I don't think LaMDA (or any other AI) is conscious or sentient. However, how will we be able to recognise it when we do create something that could be considered sentient? It seems inevitable that we will at some point. Many of the arguments used to suggest AI isn't sentient seem reductive, for example saying it's just a complex algorithm or statistical system. You could similarly say human brains are just a bunch of…

Inevitable at some point? At what point? If we are 500 years away from it does it make sense to invest resources in figuring it out now? It humans don't survive as a species is it really inevitable?

Another thing that most people don't get or don't want to acknowledge is that intelligence and consciousness is relative to the environment in which the entity is intelligent or conscious in. If you take a piece of software and expect it to be conscious the same way a human is conscious you're going to have a bad time. There is heavy heavy projection when it comes to humans interacting with basically everything. We anthropomorphize everything.

From that vantage point we will not be able to recognize intelligence and consciousness unless it look exactly as our own.

Re: Belief in AI sentience is becoming a problem

#67

Post by mirceal »

htrp wrote: post #18

The key problem is not the belief in sentience but the hysteria and potential knee jerk reactions that widespread adoption of this belief may cause. Can you imagine if laws were passed affording algorithms "human rights" or regulations created to ensure that your fancy machine learning recommender system did not pass a certain "sentience threshold"?

Hah. Interesting though experiment but in today's world even not all humans have human rights. Good luck enforcing that.

Re: Belief in AI sentience is becoming a problem

#68

Post by shak3zz »

yreg wrote: post #26
cameronh90 wrote: post #8

I don't think LaMDA (or any other AI) is conscious or sentient. However, how will we be able to recognise it when we do create something that could be considered sentient? It seems inevitable that we will at some point. Many of the arguments used to suggest AI isn't sentient seem reductive, for example saying it's just a complex algorithm or statistical system. You could similarly say human brains are just a bunch of…

>It seems inevitable that we will at some point. We have no idea what causes consciousness. The only thing I'm sure about is that I'm conscious. Are all the other people conscious? I strongly believe so, but I don't have a proof. Are all the animals conscious? I think that they are, to different degrees. Would a simulation of full human brain on a computer be conscious? Uhh, I guess so? Would the same simulation, but…

Best comment. Nobody can prove or disprove consciousness.

Re: Belief in AI sentience is becoming a problem

#69

Post by knighthack »

'Belief'... is now a problem?

If you can't believe even in a possibility, how can you do science? How can one even formulate a hypothesis and attempt to falsify it without in the first place believing in some potential outcome?

Skepticism requires an open mind to ongoing evidence and change of circumstances, not one proclaiming outright that 'belief' in itself can be a problem.

This rush to disbelief AI sentience is just as bad as those who proclaim outright that AI has reached the level of sentience. Neither, if you notice, constitutes a proper approach to science.

Re: Belief in AI sentience is becoming a problem

#70

Post by jqpabc123 »

yreg wrote: post #26
cameronh90 wrote: post #8

I don't think LaMDA (or any other AI) is conscious or sentient. However, how will we be able to recognise it when we do create something that could be considered sentient? It seems inevitable that we will at some point. Many of the arguments used to suggest AI isn't sentient seem reductive, for example saying it's just a complex algorithm or statistical system. You could similarly say human brains are just a bunch of…

>It seems inevitable that we will at some point. We have no idea what causes consciousness. The only thing I'm sure about is that I'm conscious. Are all the other people conscious? I strongly believe so, but I don't have a proof. Are all the animals conscious? I think that they are, to different degrees. Would a simulation of full human brain on a computer be conscious? Uhh, I guess so? Would the same simulation, but…

Would a simulation of full human brain on a computer be conscious? Uhh, I guess so?

The biggest fallacy in thinking about consciousness is that it is all neatly isolated in the brain. What about your nervous system? What about your gut? It's all one big interconnected system.

https://www.health.harvard.edu/diseases-and-conditions/the-g...

The truth is, until we can define consciousness; we can't possibly reproduce it on a binary logic playback device (aka a "computer").

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