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Increased Subscription Pricing for IDEs, .NET Tools, and the All Products Pack

blog.jetbrains.com

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Re: Increased Subscription Pricing for IDEs, .NET Tools, and the All Products Pack

#141

Post by joshstrange »

mmastrac wrote: post #60

The heavier IDEs are in real trouble given the impressive state of VS Code lately. I haven't found the need to reach for a bigger IDE than Code in a while and I've been perfectly productive in JS, C, Rust and Python projects lately. Do yourself a favour and try out Code for your next project.

Tried it, hated it.

It's a fine lightweight editor but if you want to refactor or do anything complex you want something like IDEA in your pocket. It comes pretty much "Batteries included" whereas you have to build your own IDE with VSCode which I don't have the time or effort for maintaining. I get that IDEs can look scary or seem bloated but once moving first to PHPStorm then IDEA I realized a lot of my "facts" about IDEs were either completely wrong and/or the heavier weight was actually worth it.

I'll be interested to see if JetBrain's new Fleet will eat into VS Code's market (it's a similar tool).

Re: Increased Subscription Pricing for IDEs, .NET Tools, and the All Products Pack

#142

Post by quietbritishjim »

babelfish wrote: post #122
bogwog wrote: post #95

Jetbrains doesn’t get my money because of how much of a confusing mess their product lineup is. They have a bunch of different IDEs sold separately that ultimately seem to be identical except for language support. Why isn’t language support implemented as plugins if all the IDEs share a common framework? Last I checked, it seemed like they do have an “ultimate” version with multiple language support… except that one…

IIRC IntelliJ is a superset of all their products

IntelliJ has two totally different meanings, by itself the name doesn't really identify a product.

IntelliJ Community is pretty much just a Java (and other JVM language) IDE.

IntelliJ Ultimate works with all the languages that work with their other IDEs (Python, Go, JavaScript, ...). This is the one you're talking about. C++ isn't listed even for this though [1]

It's definitely confusing, even if Ultimate did support C++, because IntelliJ is primarily billed as a Java IDE. And with PyCharm, for example, the free vs paid difference is many useful extra features but still primarily aimed at the same language. Maybe they should've just called it JetBrains Ultimate IDE or something, rather than mentioning their Java IDE.

[1] https://www.jetbrains.com/products/compare/?product=idea&pro...

Re: Increased Subscription Pricing for IDEs, .NET Tools, and the All Products Pack

#143

Post by 31835843 »

TacticalCoder wrote: post #116
31835843 wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>This is the first time in my life (34 yo) that price changes have been so large that they’re apparent to me. We lived through a unique time in history, and that unique time has lasted for our entire adult lives. I’m also 34. I graduated college right when the low interest rates were juicing the economy. But the party had to come to an end sometime. Ask your parents what it was like in the 1970s. Oil shocks, interest…

> Oil shocks, interest rates at 15%. History rhymes. Except the G-20 average public debt in the 70s was like 30% of the GDP. We cannot go to interest rates at 15% with countries having 100%+ public debt (as is the case nearly everywhere in Europe for example).

Good point. While the interest rates are “high” now (prime rate is 4.75?) that is actually a regression towards the mean, and definitely not 1970s hyperinflation territory.

I wonder though — given that we can’t go to that 15% rate (because then servicing public debt would be too expensive), what other tools do we have left to tame inflation?

Re: Increased Subscription Pricing for IDEs, .NET Tools, and the All Products Pack

#144

Post by sideeffffect »

dancemethis wrote: post #109

If only it was Free Software, I would pay gladly.

IntelliJ Community Edition is indeed Free Software! Apache 2.0 license, to be specific.

It's an awesome product, I recommend everybody to use it. I personally use it with its amazing Scala plug-in, also friendly licensed.

Re: Increased Subscription Pricing for IDEs, .NET Tools, and the All Products Pack

#145

Post by drdec »

mmastrac wrote: post #102
lolinder wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe it's improved in the past 3ish years, but the last time I had to use Eclipse for a project I couldn't stand it. It may have been lighter weight, but it was buggy and had many fewer helpful features (refactorings, inline hints, navigation). I couldn't wait to get back to intellij.

I don't think IntelliJ has added support for running non-compiling Java code yet, which was a major productivity booster for me. Eclipse's ability to debug and run a single failing unit test were massive as well. IntelliJ was always hit or miss as to whether it would allow you to run a subset. IntelliJ refactorings also were a lot less smart IMO - often trying to refactor unrelated comments and sometimes code that wa…

> running non-compiling Java code yet

I don't mean to sound rude here, but that just sounds like nonsense to me. How are you supposed to run code that won't compile? Does eclipse just generate random bytecodes for the party that doesn't compile?

> debug and run a single failing unit test

I'm not sure where the issue is for you, but this has always been available since I have used IntelliJ, going back 15 years.

Re: Increased Subscription Pricing for IDEs, .NET Tools, and the All Products Pack

#146

Post by levoea »

oxfordmale wrote: post #16

Most JetBrains products are super slow, and resource hogs. I get red mist in front of my eyes whenever I see a DataGrip icon as it tends to consume all your CPU and memory for complex databases regardless of your machine spec. These days I am mostly using VsCode for development and TablePlus/Postico for database development.

> Most JetBrains products are super slow, and resource hogs

Yeah, every time i've tried CLion or Rider, the heap reaches its maximum size (4-8gb) like 10-20 minutes after starting the editor and then it becomes extremely slow and sluggish. My cpu goes crazy any time i start an analysis or any sort of task. I've tried to disable on the fly analysis, plugins and whatever i could find that i don't always need to be enabled, but it's barely better.

On the other hand, I've used Intellij for years and it's never been that bad. It has much lower cpu/ram consumption even while having almost everything enabled. I've used the same configuration for years though, so it's possible that at some point I disabled whatever causes such resource usage and completely forgot about it. Or maybe the editors are actually different, though from my understanding they all share the same core.

Re: Increased Subscription Pricing for IDEs, .NET Tools, and the All Products Pack

#147

Post by kaba0 »

oxfordmale wrote: post #16

Most JetBrains products are super slow, and resource hogs. I get red mist in front of my eyes whenever I see a DataGrip icon as it tends to consume all your CPU and memory for complex databases regardless of your machine spec. These days I am mostly using VsCode for development and TablePlus/Postico for database development.

The only reason they take up more resources than necessary is that the default VM settings are bad. They use an older GC algorithm with very low RAM setting, but all it does is make the GC run much more than it would with a decent size.

If you happen to try it out again, I recommend setting the heap size to at least 4GB and removing the obsolete GC setting (defaulting to the G1 collector) or even better, changing to ZGC. Hopefully they will fix it in a newer version soon.

Re: Increased Subscription Pricing for IDEs, .NET Tools, and the All Products Pack

#148

Post by monkey_monkey »

hhariri wrote: post #128
JustFinishedBSG wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I know they were forced. I know they did it the most humane way possible. This is precisely why I support them financially. Doesn't change the fact that they had to let go of a huge portion of their staff. Call it firing, or special unemployment operation , the result is still the same; and I can't help but notice that updates are now very, very sparse and pretty minor ( maybe its a pure coincidence because they are…

I apologise for intervening, but I believe it's necessary as this statement is not correct. We did not layoff a huge portion of our staff.

No need to apologise. It's always good to counter assertions lacking in evidence with actual facts.

Re: Increased Subscription Pricing for IDEs, .NET Tools, and the All Products Pack

#149

Post by kaba0 »

323 wrote: post #33
pyprism wrote: post #15

With 10 USD, I can buy 1 weeks worth of food in my country. I wish SASS, software providers like Jetbrains adjusts their price based on country per capita.

Is your developer salary also adjusted based on country per capita? Or are you getting a mostly Western salary?

Not the parent - it is definitely a better pay than other salaries in the country, but for example in Hungary a junior gets around like 2000 USD (per month) gross (and we have quite huge income tax here as well). Around 2600 USD it would be considered a nice senior salary.

Re: Increased Subscription Pricing for IDEs, .NET Tools, and the All Products Pack

#150

Post by MockObject »

vfclists wrote: post #96
Aeolun wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not quite sure why your response is so energetic. Jetbrains products were always cheap, and now they are more expensive. I never said it’s now a bad deal. I’ve just never seen prices rise so fast. Even during the whole pandemic when China shipping basically stopped, rising prices were unnoticable. Now prices rise more, and it surprises me, that’s all.

Well I get upset when IT guys complain about stuff being not free and price hikes. It is a pet peeve with the software developers whingeing about the cost of tools. I guess I overreacted to your statement. I remember spending over $300 in todays money for Delphi when it first come out in 1995, and in my view it was well spent. It wasn't even in employment related then. I considered the tool useful for my personal des…

He could switch to Delphi, but that wouldn't stop him from considering JetBrains' prices expensive.
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