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Anonymous Cancels Operation Cartel as Los Zetas Track Hacktivists

idealab.talkingpointsmemo.com

31–40 of 162 posts

Re: Anonymous Cancels Operation Cartel as Los Zetas Track Hacktivists

#31

The trouble with movements like Anonymous is that there is no centralized authority. Further, a group pushing for anarchy is either hypocritical if it's effective (because it will be organized) or ineffective because it's anarchical and disorganized. Anonymous is not a serious threat to large corporations. It may cost them a minor inconveniencr, but without centralized authority, the group has no real internal integr…

It also makes it rather difficult to deny it if accused.

Re: Anonymous Cancels Operation Cartel as Los Zetas Track Hacktivists

#32
post #20

It's difficult to wage an information war with gangsters. The ones who get to the top by killing and torturing are not likely to be threatened by having a few emails released. All the shit runs downhill to the relatively innocent civilians being extorted by the gangsters. If knowledge of who the crime bosses are was enough to take them down, they would not exist in the first place. Organized crime does not require se…

The only way to fight criminals at a scale where they threaten the state is through intelligence and military techniques, not law enforcement. Find them, build up decent evidence, kill them; don't try to prosecute. The risk is turning into a star chamber or right wing paramilitary, but I would trust the professionalism and morality of an organization like the us military to resist that. Plan Colombia worked out ok, c…

Decent evidence often isn't. Remember those 'weapons of mass destruction' in Iraq? 4,482 dead American soldiers and counting.

I'm not saying these gangs aren't full of horrible people, and I'm not saying all branches of the US government and military aren't perfectly good intentioned and well-meaning people, but mistakes do get made - which is why we need some judicial oversight here.

We've already got one war on an abstract concept where the president can order the extrajudicial execution of a US citizen based on secret evidence. That's more than enough for me.

Re: Anonymous Cancels Operation Cartel as Los Zetas Track Hacktivists

#33
post #20

It's difficult to wage an information war with gangsters. The ones who get to the top by killing and torturing are not likely to be threatened by having a few emails released. All the shit runs downhill to the relatively innocent civilians being extorted by the gangsters. If knowledge of who the crime bosses are was enough to take them down, they would not exist in the first place. Organized crime does not require se…

The only way to fight criminals at a scale where they threaten the state is through intelligence and military techniques, not law enforcement. Find them, build up decent evidence, kill them; don't try to prosecute. The risk is turning into a star chamber or right wing paramilitary, but I would trust the professionalism and morality of an organization like the us military to resist that. Plan Colombia worked out ok, c…

Or end the futile prohibition on drugs and tax them instead. Worked for alcohol.

Re: Anonymous Cancels Operation Cartel as Los Zetas Track Hacktivists

#34
post #20

It's difficult to wage an information war with gangsters. The ones who get to the top by killing and torturing are not likely to be threatened by having a few emails released. All the shit runs downhill to the relatively innocent civilians being extorted by the gangsters. If knowledge of who the crime bosses are was enough to take them down, they would not exist in the first place. Organized crime does not require se…

The only way to fight criminals at a scale where they threaten the state is through intelligence and military techniques, not law enforcement. Find them, build up decent evidence, kill them; don't try to prosecute. The risk is turning into a star chamber or right wing paramilitary, but I would trust the professionalism and morality of an organization like the us military to resist that. Plan Colombia worked out ok, c…

Has that ever worked? In the U.S. anyway, gangs only seemed to disappear after pretty intense FBI work. I'm thinking of stuff like http://www.fbi.gov/about-us/investigate/organizedcrime/itali... but maybe there's much more militarized approach that's been effective that i'm forgetting.

Re: Anonymous Cancels Operation Cartel as Los Zetas Track Hacktivists

#35
post #33
post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The only way to fight criminals at a scale where they threaten the state is through intelligence and military techniques, not law enforcement. Find them, build up decent evidence, kill them; don't try to prosecute. The risk is turning into a star chamber or right wing paramilitary, but I would trust the professionalism and morality of an organization like the us military to resist that. Plan Colombia worked out ok, c…

Or end the futile prohibition on drugs and tax them instead. Worked for alcohol.

For values of 'worked for alcohol' that include 'moved world's largest criminal organisation into non-alcohol-related activity without impacting its organisational capacity one jot'.

Re: Anonymous Cancels Operation Cartel as Los Zetas Track Hacktivists

#36
post #33
post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The only way to fight criminals at a scale where they threaten the state is through intelligence and military techniques, not law enforcement. Find them, build up decent evidence, kill them; don't try to prosecute. The risk is turning into a star chamber or right wing paramilitary, but I would trust the professionalism and morality of an organization like the us military to resist that. Plan Colombia worked out ok, c…

Or end the futile prohibition on drugs and tax them instead. Worked for alcohol.

That is an over-simplified solution to a complicated problem. Organized crime would change, not cease to exist. Countries where prostitution is legal still see organized abuses in the industry, like brothel owners not following regulations, etc. Moreover, marijuana has the highest likelihood of being legalized of any drug (still not likely) and yet, it is the lowest profit margin for organized crime. Cocaine, ecstasy, heroin, etc. are much more profitable, and legalizing these would be socially irresponsible, if fiscally lucrative.

Re: Anonymous Cancels Operation Cartel as Los Zetas Track Hacktivists

#37
post #34
post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The only way to fight criminals at a scale where they threaten the state is through intelligence and military techniques, not law enforcement. Find them, build up decent evidence, kill them; don't try to prosecute. The risk is turning into a star chamber or right wing paramilitary, but I would trust the professionalism and morality of an organization like the us military to resist that. Plan Colombia worked out ok, c…

Has that ever worked? In the U.S. anyway, gangs only seemed to disappear after pretty intense FBI work. I'm thinking of stuff like http://www.fbi.gov/about-us/investigate/organizedcrime/itali... but maybe there's much more militarized approach that's been effective that i'm forgetting.

There aren't criminal organizations in the USA which can credibly threaten state governments, let aloe the Feds.

This is different in other countries. Hence, law enforcement to solve crime in the USA; targeted killings in Mexico.

Re: Anonymous Cancels Operation Cartel as Los Zetas Track Hacktivists

#38
post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or end the futile prohibition on drugs and tax them instead. Worked for alcohol.

For values of 'worked for alcohol' that include 'moved world's largest criminal organisation into non-alcohol-related activity without impacting its organisational capacity one jot'.

Exactly. Crime would adjust itself, or find a new market. Compromising by legalizing something which has a purpose in being illegal is detrimental to solving the problem.
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