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Stop using app icons for political activism

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Re: Stop using app icons for political activism

#171

The author didn’t bother to state which political statements they were upset about; neither did they bother to say something like “all of them,” which would have been trivial. So we are left to guess which political activism they find annoying. Given the timing, there’s a very good chance that it’s related to Pride month here in the US. It seems even more probable when you consider the context: very few companies cha…

> So: odds are, the author is upset about having LGBTQ “activism” pushed on their devices. Your guess is probably correct. We all know why they aren't being explicit about it, right? Someone here literally threatened that they "actively" won't hire me for commenting on this post :-) > Specifically, remember that a vague assertion that LGBTQ people exist It's not vague at all, it's literally a flag. And it's not an ac…

> The most charitable interpretation is that it's a protest against heteronormativity

Protest? Come on. The most charitable interpretation is that the person making such a statement merely think non hetero people deserve the same rights as anyone else. Which is quite different from taking a position against something.

Re: Stop using app icons for political activism

#172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I would invite everyone to remember this the next time someone wants a “politics-free” workspace. Specifically, remember that a vague assertion that LGBTQ people exist (a rainbow, on a logo), is what some folks consider “political.” There are many things that "just exist", but one subset of them receives massive media attention, mandatory acknowledgments, and is shielded from a lot of criticism, while another subset…

> mandatory acknowledgments Who mandates that? > shielded from a lot of criticism By whom? From where I stand, a lot of folks have stated calling me and mine “groomers,” which is pretty critical in my book. They seem free enough to criticize to me? > while another subset is constantly being ridiculed, mocked and villified Each side mocks the other; so it seems to be a moot point to me. > Pride month would be fair if…

> The world broadcasts heterosexuality on every corner. What’s the difference?

There isn’t one. There is too much blatant heterosexuality in our culture.

> The media certainly has not decided as much. This is still what we, as a society, glorify. What would you say shows that the media has decided these things are no longer important?

That we don’t have a month celebrating abstinence and sexual propriety?

Re: Stop using app icons for political activism

#173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> That said, the author didn’t tell us; so we’re left to guess. We don't need to guess. The post was agnostic to the political cause.

Not mentioning a cause is not the same thing as being agnostic.

The post itself was, though, as the gp post wrote.

Re: Stop using app icons for political activism

#174

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Of course: there is significant risk to saying hateful and bigoted things outright, so folks resort to dog-whistling. Conservatives make the same argument about things their in group finds important as well. Taking the lords name in vein, disparaging mohammed, etc. Your in group is in power so you’re able to speak power to truth, but it isn’t a principled or healthy stance. Society needs to learn how to tolerate di…

The juxtaposition between “Conservatives make the same argument” and “Your in group is in power” seems to imply that you think liberals are in power. I can assure you that they are not, at least not in the US. They are currently in power in name only, and structurally even that will be an unlikely outcome for the foreseeable future. > Society needs to learn how to tolerate differing opinions. Would you care to expand…

> I can assure you that they are not, at least not in the US.

That's not really the case, and I assume that's probably good news for you since you seem to be a liberal.

The vast majority of non-democratic institutions in the US lean heavily liberal: media, academia, and tech companies are all very liberal. The current SCOTUS is the only major exception.

It might not remain like this forever though, because they are alienating a good chunk of the population.

Re: Stop using app icons for political activism

#175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

1. Mcdonalds is 'normalized'. Everybody knows you can get a double quarter pounder at mcdonalds. Christanity is not noticed. The public rarely knows the content of the faith it rejects. And the point is reinforced by the complete lack of knowledge about what it is and how pride might impact it, in this conversation. 2. "Normalization" and "oppression" are not words that mean what I'm talking about. Christianity is "u…

I would argue that practitioners of the faith rarely know the content of the faith they practice. Hence the extreme anti-LGBT stance pushed in their politics and preferred media, despite the conspicuous lack of relevant scripture. And this extremity is definitely something LGBT folks see all the time. Their states are passing laws banning them from sports and bathrooms. LGBT issues can no longer be mentioned in their…

I have zero interest in playing the 'pity card. Even though compassion is a good thing.

I'm just saying the truth as I see it and think shared knowledge should be the basis of political unity, not activist tribalism.

Re: Stop using app icons for political activism

#176

The author didn’t bother to state which political statements they were upset about; neither did they bother to say something like “all of them,” which would have been trivial. So we are left to guess which political activism they find annoying. Given the timing, there’s a very good chance that it’s related to Pride month here in the US. It seems even more probable when you consider the context: very few companies cha…

Why are you assuming it's about a specific issue? The author made it pretty clear it's about the principle and not a specific issue.

From the author: "I might actually agree with your political cause, but you crossed a line."

Re: Stop using app icons for political activism

#177

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> mandatory acknowledgments Who mandates that? > shielded from a lot of criticism By whom? From where I stand, a lot of folks have stated calling me and mine “groomers,” which is pretty critical in my book. They seem free enough to criticize to me? > while another subset is constantly being ridiculed, mocked and villified Each side mocks the other; so it seems to be a moot point to me. > Pride month would be fair if…

> The world broadcasts heterosexuality on every corner. What’s the difference? There isn’t one. There is too much blatant heterosexuality in our culture. > The media certainly has not decided as much. This is still what we, as a society, glorify. What would you say shows that the media has decided these things are no longer important? That we don’t have a month celebrating abstinence and sexual propriety?

> That we don’t have a month celebrating abstinence and sexual propriety?

My statement was referring to the immediate parent, which bemoaned the lack of “Fathers appreciation month” and “housewives appreciation.”

How does the lack of an “abstinence celebration month” support the idea I was responding to - the idea that the media has decided that “fathers” and “housewives” are unimportant?

> There is too much blatant heterosexuality in our culture.

We certainly agree on that.

Re: Stop using app icons for political activism

#178
post #171

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> So: odds are, the author is upset about having LGBTQ “activism” pushed on their devices. Your guess is probably correct. We all know why they aren't being explicit about it, right? Someone here literally threatened that they "actively" won't hire me for commenting on this post :-) > Specifically, remember that a vague assertion that LGBTQ people exist It's not vague at all, it's literally a flag. And it's not an ac…

> The most charitable interpretation is that it's a protest against heteronormativity Protest ? Come on. The most charitable interpretation is that the person making such a statement merely think non hetero people deserve the same rights as anyone else. Which is quite different from taking a position against something.

Not really, from Wikipedia [1]:

> Heteronormativity is the concept that heterosexuality is the preferred or normal mode of sexual orientation. It assumes the gender binary (i.e., that there are only two distinct, opposite genders) and that sexual and marital relations are most fitting between people of opposite sex.

The idea of promoting a "gender binary" and treating the exceptions as abnormalities is quite diagonal to displaying a Rainbow flag. So is believing that heterosexuality is "normal" in some sense.

[1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Heteronormativity...

Re: Stop using app icons for political activism

#179

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The juxtaposition between “Conservatives make the same argument” and “Your in group is in power” seems to imply that you think liberals are in power. I can assure you that they are not, at least not in the US. They are currently in power in name only, and structurally even that will be an unlikely outcome for the foreseeable future. > Society needs to learn how to tolerate differing opinions. Would you care to expand…

> I can assure you that they are not, at least not in the US. That's not really the case, and I assume that's probably good news for you since you seem to be a liberal. The vast majority of non-democratic institutions in the US lean heavily liberal: media, academia, and tech companies are all very liberal. The current SCOTUS is the only major exception. It might not remain like this forever though, because they are a…

> The vast majority of non-democratic institutions in the US lean heavily liberal: media, academia, and tech companies are all very liberal. The current SCOTUS is the only major exception.

Mixing democratic and non-democratic institutions hardly seems fair, especially since only one of those has the direct power to govern.

You left out the Senate, which is split 50/50 and likely won’t be shortly. You also left out state governments, which are overwhelmingly controlled in totality by the Conservative party. Not to mention the federal judiciary.

The idea that conservatives aren’t in control is simply false; they are in control of vast swaths of government, and will almost certainly consolidate that power shortly. Even the nominally liberal-controlled elements of government are stymied by the conservative element, a defacto loss of control.

If you want to stick to soft power, we could talk more about that. But if you want to include hard power, then your argument holds no water.

Re: Stop using app icons for political activism

#180

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I would invite everyone to remember this the next time someone wants a “politics-free” workspace. Specifically, remember that a vague assertion that LGBTQ people exist (a rainbow, on a logo), is what some folks consider “political.” There are many things that "just exist", but one subset of them receives massive media attention, mandatory acknowledgments, and is shielded from a lot of criticism, while another subset…

> mandatory acknowledgments Who mandates that? > shielded from a lot of criticism By whom? From where I stand, a lot of folks have stated calling me and mine “groomers,” which is pretty critical in my book. They seem free enough to criticize to me? > while another subset is constantly being ridiculed, mocked and villified Each side mocks the other; so it seems to be a moot point to me. > Pride month would be fair if…

>By whom? From where I stand, a lot of folks have stated calling me and mine “groomers,” which is pretty critical in my book.

That's a very specific thing. Children of certain ages would go great lengths to feel different from the previous generation, "cool", "hip". Decades of various subcultures from Punks to Emos is pretty solid evidence. Grooming is trying to use the need to feel different in order to convince them to do sex-related things before they have a solid intrinsic feeling for it. The motivation for groomers could be finding these children sexually attractive, trolling (deliberately convincing someone to do irreversible changes that will cause them long-term suffering), or compensating for the groomer's own childhood trauma by forcing others to relive it (the worst bullies are former bully victims). I think, this is a legitimate problem and it's important to distinguish it from initiatives that actually help children (e.g. preventing bullying based on looks).

>They seem free enough to criticize to me?

No mainstream media outlet ever covers this angle - it's a complete taboo. But there are plenty of examples where rather mild criticism is immediately branded homophobic/transphobic and actions are taken to prevent other people from considering this point of view.

>The world broadcasts heterosexuality on every corner.

I would be interested to hear some examples.

>You can’t say that one group is being given “different rights” and then in the next breath say that it’s actually “non-monetary tokenism.” Rhetorically, that’s nonsensical.

Respectfully disagree. People do have an intrinsic need for some amount of other's attention, and can feel it very well. Many social rituals are built around it: networking (periodically paying attention to each other), arts (having others pay attention to what you create), the concept of celebrities. The HR departments have figured out long ago that some amount of coworkers' attention can substitute a raise (in terms of lowering the % of resignations). Like the whole "employee of the month" posters. I call it non-monetary because it doesn't cost the employer nearly as much as a sizable pay raise. But it's something people subconsciously feel and track very well. You take a small amount of everyone's attention and you direct it towards a specific group or individual. People belonging to that group feel slightly rewarded, people outside it feel slightly demotivated. Like if your boss congratulated your coworker with their birthday, but didn't congratulate you.

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