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Probiotics can support the effect of antidepressants

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Re: Probiotics can support the effect of antidepressants

#91

Post by okdood64 »

logankeenan wrote: post #76
ianstormtaylor wrote: post #24

Anyone have recommendations for which probiotics are the best ones to buy? I always get confused while looking at all the various options, and this seems like a good place to find someone who’s done a lot of research.

Disclaimer, I’m a software engineer for Ritual. Antidotally, I recently started taking a probiotic and have had great improvements in digestive health. I also have a chronic digestive disease. Ritual recently launched a probiotic which includes the two most studied strains, LGG and BB-12. Our formulation and technology is very much driven by science. Maybe it’s right for you. https://ritual.com/products/synbiotic-plu…

Off-topic: Please don't take this the wrong way. What sorts of engineering does an engineer at Ritual do? From an outside perspective it's just a website selling healthcare products. Is there some sort of big data driven approach to developing the products?

Re: Probiotics can support the effect of antidepressants

#92

Post by amelius »

chasebank wrote: post #53
SaintGhurka wrote: post #21

Sample size of 1 here, but just hear me out. Probiotics are a cheap and low-risk. If you have any general inflammation type issues that don't seem to have a cause, it might be worthwhile to just try probiotics. My Dr. told me to try them for a digestive issue - and they sort of helped that. But a handful of other things unexpectedly improved. Acid reflux went from really bad to barely noticeable, and my skin really c…

I have a sample size of 1 as well. Probiotics didn’t help me but I’ve dealt with digestive issues for the last 4 years after a bout of food poisoning. I used to think gut flora / microbiome was quackery but I recently did an oral FMT (fecal microbiata transplant) the results were unreal. For reference, I’m a 37 y/o fit male and donor was 18 y/o female. After 2nd week I got the deepest sleep since I was a child (slept…

This is what doctors call "the honeymoon phase", and it can happen with various drugs and supplements.

If it stops working, and you can't reproduce it the second or third time, then it's probably better to give up and look for another solution.

Re: Probiotics can support the effect of antidepressants

#93

Post by Auracle »

phkahler wrote: post #87
SaintGhurka wrote: post #21

Sample size of 1 here, but just hear me out. Probiotics are a cheap and low-risk. If you have any general inflammation type issues that don't seem to have a cause, it might be worthwhile to just try probiotics. My Dr. told me to try them for a digestive issue - and they sort of helped that. But a handful of other things unexpectedly improved. Acid reflux went from really bad to barely noticeable, and my skin really c…

The problem I have with "take probiotics" is that there are hundreds or even thousands of species of bacteria that could be classified as "probiotics". Which ones of these have positive influence on mood or physical health? How can a person know what to expect from a bottle of stuff at Whole Foods or where-ever?

I wonder if prebiotics are a better choice, with fecal transplants done for when you have a real issue.

For what it’s worth, and doctors obviously don’t suggest this, you can easily do a fecal transplant at home. By “easily” I mean that the process is simple, not that it isn’t super gross.

Re: Probiotics can support the effect of antidepressants

#94

Post by chasebank »

SaintGhurka wrote: post #64
chasebank wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have a sample size of 1 as well. Probiotics didn’t help me but I’ve dealt with digestive issues for the last 4 years after a bout of food poisoning. I used to think gut flora / microbiome was quackery but I recently did an oral FMT (fecal microbiata transplant) the results were unreal. For reference, I’m a 37 y/o fit male and donor was 18 y/o female. After 2nd week I got the deepest sleep since I was a child (slept…

Are you sure you don't have sleep apnea? I did... or rather I do, but if I sleep with a CPAP machine, I wake up with a feeling like you describe. I hate that machine, but it works.

I'm pretty sure I don't. I suppose I could try one out or get a test.

Re: Probiotics can support the effect of antidepressants

#95

Post by stainforth »

philliphaydon wrote: post #60
SaintGhurka wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Culturelle. Just their basic "Digestive Daily Probiotic". It's a single strain Lactobacillus rhamnosus. My Dr. suggested either that or Align. The first thing I tried worked so I haven't tried anything else. A friend of mine had the same problem and he buys generic bulk acidophilus from amazon and he says it works for him. I didn't expect it to work, but I didn't want to wonder if it failed because I cheaped out, so…

Definitely going to try this too. I go though periods of acid reflux and it wakes me up. I sleep with 2 pillows so raise my head and shoulders to prevent it waking me which helps most of the time. But will give the probiotics a try. Thanks.

Curious - are you a back sleeper? (Or what type of sleeper are you?)

Re: Probiotics can support the effect of antidepressants

#96

Post by pygy_ »

phkahler wrote: post #87
SaintGhurka wrote: post #21

Sample size of 1 here, but just hear me out. Probiotics are a cheap and low-risk. If you have any general inflammation type issues that don't seem to have a cause, it might be worthwhile to just try probiotics. My Dr. told me to try them for a digestive issue - and they sort of helped that. But a handful of other things unexpectedly improved. Acid reflux went from really bad to barely noticeable, and my skin really c…

The problem I have with "take probiotics" is that there are hundreds or even thousands of species of bacteria that could be classified as "probiotics". Which ones of these have positive influence on mood or physical health? How can a person know what to expect from a bottle of stuff at Whole Foods or where-ever?

In the absence of more precise evidence, I’d recommend to aim for diversity, you’re more likely to pick up what you’re missing that way. You can also try diy lactofermented veggies.

Re: Probiotics can support the effect of antidepressants

#97

Post by wbsss4412 »

cpncrunch wrote: post #62
PragmaticPulp wrote: post #41

Full paper here: https://www.nature.com/articles/s41398-022-01977-z Skip down to Figure 1 to see the chart. Note that the response to placebo is normally extremely strong in depression studies, so it’s normal to see both groups improve drastically like this. The only thing that jumps out to me is that the probiotic group started with HAM-D depression inventory scores that were notably higher. When measuring absolute…

HN users seem to have a habit of posting crap science wrapped up in impressive sounding news stories, and it's kind of annoying. This is meant to be a group of intelligent people who should have the ability to click on the link to the article and look at the actual results.

HN tends to have a lot of insight into tech topics, and a high level of hubris when it comes to non tech topics.

Re: Probiotics can support the effect of antidepressants

#98

Post by awinter-py »

actual results are in figure 1 of the linked article

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41398-022-01977-z/figures/1

they were using the HAM-D instrument to measure impact. The probiotics group appears to have initial +2 HAM-D (19 vs 17), and have -1 at follow-up (7 vs 8).

This is for relatively small N (21 completed probiotics course, 26 placebo), and the fact that the difference is smaller at the end vs at the beginning says 'within the noise' to me.

results section also notes probiotic group had twice the drop-out rate of the placebo group (30% vs 13%)

Re: Probiotics can support the effect of antidepressants

#99

Post by ada1981 »

Auracle wrote: post #93
phkahler wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem I have with "take probiotics" is that there are hundreds or even thousands of species of bacteria that could be classified as "probiotics". Which ones of these have positive influence on mood or physical health? How can a person know what to expect from a bottle of stuff at Whole Foods or where-ever?

I wonder if prebiotics are a better choice, with fecal transplants done for when you have a real issue. For what it’s worth, and doctors obviously don’t suggest this, you can easily do a fecal transplant at home. By “easily” I mean that the process is simple, not that it isn’t super gross.

Having dirty sex with happy people is how our species has done this since the Dawn of man.

Re: Probiotics can support the effect of antidepressants

#100

Post by kudzoo »

A healthy gut microbiome has a diversity of bacteria. You want to have a healthy gut microbiome because it has an incredible number of interactions with your nervous system, which can impact mood, energy, and brain function.

Below is a quick rundown of the essential tools for feeding one's gut microbiome.

- Prebiotics: Carbohydrates and fiber that our body can't digest but act as food for the bacteria in our gut.

- Active culture foods: Yogurt, sauerkraut, kimchi, etc that contain active bacteria which support the growth of other bacteria.

- Probiotics supplements: contain live active cultures.

If you have a depleted gut microbiome due to stress, disease or recent usage of antibiotics, probiotics are useful to restart the gut microbiome but probably aren't needed for maintenance. Instead, you may be better off eating a diet that contains a healthy amount of prebiotics (fiber, complex carbs) and fermented foods.

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