SpaceX said to fire employees involved in letter rebuking Elon Musk • Hacker News Board

Re: SpaceX said to fire employees involved in letter rebuking Elon Musk

#321

Post by CBarkleyU » Fri, Jun 17, 2022, 2:36 PM UTC

deltaonefour wrote: post #241

jmyeet wrote: post #153

I'm really starting to wonder if 2022 won't be looked back as the year that Elon finally jumped the shark. A lot of people (myself included) really respect SpaceX and I think that's the last pillar on which Elon's reputation stands. Tesla honestly isn't that interesting and there's a real chance it gets eaten alive as other car manufacturers have caught up. The Cybertruck is still vaporware whereas the F150 Lightning…

Eh he comes off as a normal human being to me. Definitely quite awful, but that's also very normal. The difference between Elon and others is that Elon doesn't put on as big of a facade. There are CEO's who are psychopaths and are much worse then Elon but are much better at keeping their actual persona hidden. Elon is just as awful as the next human being. We tend to have a higher set of expectations for people in El…

This is a fallacy that really irks me. You can't even argue against a statement like that. If Person A acts like a decent human being it's because they're putting on a facade, if Person A acts like a dumpster fire it's because they're not putting on a facade.

Would you describe your inner circle of friends as "quite awful"? I really hope you wouldn't. I certainly don't. And I presume most people don't. So there must be sizable amount of human being that another sizable amount of human beings consider good humans. The CEO of the multi-billion dollar company I work for seems and acts like a normal (meaning decent, as opposed to your definition "quite awful") human being. Never goes on rants like Elon, quite worker-friendly, always there to chat, doesn't fire people on the spot because they can't answer a question that he only started verbalizing halfway though his stream of consciousness rants. And we compete in the same industry as Elon. Isn't trying to influence politics with his position on several dozens of matters that have nothing to do with out company. Also doesn't cultivate a cult following with himself as the head of the cult.

That's all that matters to me, if there no evidence of him being an awful human being, it would be downright unethical for me to assume that he is an awful human being hiding behind a facade.

Also: Before anyone hits me with the "Well your CEO isnt a visionary trying to get us to Mars". Well, yeah. I'd rather be stuck on Earth with him than live under whatever fantasy a sociopath is promising to unfold on Mars.

Re: SpaceX said to fire employees involved in letter rebuking Elon Musk

#322

Post by t0mmyb0y » Fri, Jun 17, 2022, 2:36 PM UTC

kmos17 wrote: post #285

gfodor wrote: post #210

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quoted post unavailable.

Where has the left gone off the deep end other than in Tucker's lunatic and manipulative ravings? Please give us concrete examples, yes woke politics might have gone overboard for many's tastes but where has that had any real impact on day to day life? In the mean time the right has gone full throttle on an anti-democracy cult following of a single person's unproven and clearly false claims of election fraud, and tak…

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Re: SpaceX said to fire employees involved in letter rebuking Elon Musk

#323

Post by joyeuse6701 » Fri, Jun 17, 2022, 2:36 PM UTC

shswkna wrote: post #283

nocoolnametom wrote: post #97

Musk may end up being the most influential person to: 1. Electrify our vehicular infrastructure 2. Get humans to the Moon, if not to Mars 3. Accelerate the unionization of Silicon Valley tech workers His approach to remote-vs-in-office work is less that of a data-informed futurist and more that of an autocrat. Just as he's loudly supporting public free speech as long as it's his speech, I predict within a few months…

> as long as it's not within his companies Where does the idea originate that there has to be a democracy in a private company? If I were to take my money and start a company, and risk it all, I would go to great lengths (within the law) to make decisions that make my venture successful. That does involve exercising my rights to choose employees that further this goal, and firing those that don’t. Democracy in politi…

Because he markets himself one way but acts another. As you point out, one can be both a champion of democracy and someone who runs a company with a standard hierarchy, but he doesn’t market himself that way. It’s fugazzi.

Re: SpaceX said to fire employees involved in letter rebuking Elon Musk

#324

Post by loudmax » Fri, Jun 17, 2022, 2:36 PM UTC

gfodor wrote: post #210

jmyeet wrote: post #153

I'm really starting to wonder if 2022 won't be looked back as the year that Elon finally jumped the shark. A lot of people (myself included) really respect SpaceX and I think that's the last pillar on which Elon's reputation stands. Tesla honestly isn't that interesting and there's a real chance it gets eaten alive as other car manufacturers have caught up. The Cybertruck is still vaporware whereas the F150 Lightning…

Quoted post unavailable.

> This doesn’t make them conservative

I'm not a conservative, but I respect conservative values such as the rule of law. I will grant you that the populist wing of the Republican party in no way reflects conservative values.

Re: SpaceX said to fire employees involved in letter rebuking Elon Musk

#325

Post by bigmattystyles » Fri, Jun 17, 2022, 2:36 PM UTC

simonh wrote: post #311

bigmattystyles wrote: post #194

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think he jumped the shark, more like the curtain fell down and there was not much there but marketing and crowd-work savvy.

If only he'd achieved something practical, like revolutionising reusable rocket technology, dominating the commercial satelite launch industry, or selling 75% of the electric cars in the US last year. He may be an arse, but he's a very successful arse that gets stuff done. Doesn't excuse him being an arse though.

Did he though or did Gwynne Shotwell and the actual engineers? He deserves some credit, but I'm not sure it's quite as much as you think it is.

Re: SpaceX said to fire employees involved in letter rebuking Elon Musk

#326

Post by daenz » Fri, Jun 17, 2022, 2:36 PM UTC

Justin_K wrote: post #301

justinph wrote: post #257

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wasn't it an internal letter that was leaked? I mean sure, being leaked is a predictable consequence, but it may be a distinction with a difference if the criticizers didn't themselves leak it. Regardless, will be interesting to see how this plays out. If I were one of those employees, I'd be talking to a lawyer. If I was one of the employees still working at SpaceX, I'd be talking about a union. We recently unionize…

Getting fired for insubordination isn't a protected class. The former employees don't have a case.

>insubordination isn't a protected class

If some of the comments in this thread is any indicator, people seem to believe it should be a protected class, which is extremely disturbing.

Re: SpaceX said to fire employees involved in letter rebuking Elon Musk

#327

Post by jeffwask » Fri, Jun 17, 2022, 2:36 PM UTC

jmyeet wrote: post #153

I'm really starting to wonder if 2022 won't be looked back as the year that Elon finally jumped the shark. A lot of people (myself included) really respect SpaceX and I think that's the last pillar on which Elon's reputation stands. Tesla honestly isn't that interesting and there's a real chance it gets eaten alive as other car manufacturers have caught up. The Cybertruck is still vaporware whereas the F150 Lightning…

His shady practices around market manipulation are starting to catch up to him. He's facing lawsuits from shareholders for tanking his own stock prices. He slimes his way through every loophole.

Re: SpaceX said to fire employees involved in letter rebuking Elon Musk

#328

Post by piva00 » Fri, Jun 17, 2022, 2:36 PM UTC

daenz wrote: post #193

mcguire wrote: post #180

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Surprised? No. There's no large company in the world where attacking top management won't lead to major consequences. Of course, SpaceX (and Google, along with a stack of other "tech" companies) wasn't supposed to be just another large company; they wanted to disrupt things, and wanted fanatical buy-in from their employees, customers, and fans. (Corporate fans? Really?) It'll take a while, because religions don't die…

I'm not sure I fully understand your point. Are you saying that because they wanted to be "different", they should allow behavior like this?

Not from what I understand, I understood as they wanted to sell this image of being different and tolerant but are just the usual corporation.

Re: SpaceX said to fire employees involved in letter rebuking Elon Musk

#329

Post by michaelt » Fri, Jun 17, 2022, 2:37 PM UTC

bitexploder wrote: post #151

user_named wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wait six month, when the Tesla stock has crashed and he gets margin called. He's going to go nuts and have an epic fall from grace.

If I might be so bold, I don’t think anyone around here really appreciates Musk’s antics very much. However Tesla and SpaceX are fundamentally sound, if overvalued, businesses. Since the start of Tesla he has had loud and obnoxious detractors who have had any number of reasons Tesla is about to implode. Instead they keep churning out solid EVs and SpaceX keeps putting stuff in space. As much as I dislike him, I would…

Tesla is certainly a solid business in the sense that they make cars people are happy to buy. I certainly wouldn't expect the value of the business to drop to zero.

But Tesla has a Price/Earnings ratio of 100 while other car companies like Toyota only have a P/E of 10. So Tesla's stock price could drop a long way while still being reasonable.

And if Musk had got a loan against his Tesla stock to buy Twitter, a substantial drop in Tesla's price could have disproportionate results.

Re: SpaceX said to fire employees involved in letter rebuking Elon Musk

#330

Post by d23 » Fri, Jun 17, 2022, 2:37 PM UTC

memish wrote: post #273

jmyeet wrote: post #153

I'm really starting to wonder if 2022 won't be looked back as the year that Elon finally jumped the shark. A lot of people (myself included) really respect SpaceX and I think that's the last pillar on which Elon's reputation stands. Tesla honestly isn't that interesting and there's a real chance it gets eaten alive as other car manufacturers have caught up. The Cybertruck is still vaporware whereas the F150 Lightning…

[flagged]

> Grow a spine and push back against the illiberal left.

Utterly insane. Black is white, up is down. Multi-level, coordinated conspiracies orchestrated by the sitting President of the United States are the embodiment of liberal democracy.