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Codecademy and the Future of (Not) Learning to Code

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Re: Codecademy and the Future of (Not) Learning to Code

#21

Post by sgerrand »

ralphsaunders wrote: post #7
tedkalaw wrote: post #4

I am kind of surprised by this, especially given all of the positive comments. It took Audrey's post to make me realize that if I were reading HN, a lot of those positive comments would be, well..technical people. So now I'm torn. My girlfriend is a graphic designer who wants to learn to code, and I'll probably have her give CodeAcademy a shot. And then maybe CodeSchool, since I have a subscription. How have the non-…

I taught myself to code (HTML, CSS, and a small amount of PHP — Wordpress) while I was doing a Graphic Design ND. I think the hardest part for me, like Audrey, was trying to understand what a lot of the terms mean and also the concepts behind them. I distinctly remember following a basic HTML & CSS tutorial and not being able to work out how to get the CSS to style the HTML. The example code worked fine, but the rela…

Perhaps visiting the W3C website (http://w3.org/) is a good place to start if you are looking to understand how the Web works. Learning to "code" is not a short journey for the uninitiated, but the journey can be a valuable and rewarding one.

Re: Codecademy and the Future of (Not) Learning to Code

#22

Post by bmahmood »

I'm teaching myself to code right now, and have tried 3 different introductory courses/guides, including CodeAcademy. The problem I've faced with each one is I'd learn the same thing (methods, arrays, variables, conditional statements, etc) but was never able to piece together the practical use. I'd get what if/then clauses mean, and what arrays do, but never could grasp their broader functionality or use case in an actual program.

I recently started taking Stanford's CS106A class online, and its the only thing that's really clicked for me so far. The first few weeks teach you the same thing as other guides, but they create an introductory program for you to test out the basics, and help you learn the methodology of programming.

From there is where I realized what's lacking in most "learning-to-code" intro courses: they'll give you the tools to code, but don't help you learn the methodology of coding. I realize now its a very different mindset, and if you don't actually solve problems with those tools, its difficult to learn conceptually.

Hopefully CodeAcademy can crack this issue of helping people learn how to think like a programmer, and not just show the tools that programmers use essentially.

Re: Codecademy and the Future of (Not) Learning to Code

#23

Post by DanBC »

jeffreymcmanus wrote: post #20
rguzman wrote: post #3

i mostly agree with this. the way you learn how to code is the same way you learn anything else: by doing it. that is, you want to know so bad that you try to do it or someone forces you to do it. that's 80% of the battle. mentorship, tools, and pedagogy (and badges!) probably make up the other 20% of the battle, though. codeacademy fits there. i don't know if what they have is effective or not, but surely they are s…

But learn-it-yourself is not the way you "learn anything else". There are almost no other professions where this is the case. Surgeons and lawyers aren't expected to learn on their own. The fact that software engineers are expected to do so seems crazy to me -- and potentially dangerous.

Surgeons are expected to learn by doing; they're just very heavily supervised when they start on live people and they spend time on grapefruit, dead pigs, and dead people first.

Reading about a new technique is great. Applying that technique is how a surgeon would learn to do it.

Re: Codecademy and the Future of (Not) Learning to Code

#24

Post by willpower101 »

willpower101 wrote: post #16
ralphsaunders wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I taught myself to code (HTML, CSS, and a small amount of PHP — Wordpress) while I was doing a Graphic Design ND. I think the hardest part for me, like Audrey, was trying to understand what a lot of the terms mean and also the concepts behind them. I distinctly remember following a basic HTML & CSS tutorial and not being able to work out how to get the CSS to style the HTML. The example code worked fine, but the rela…

I find myself saying this a lot and I mean no offense but HTML and CSS aren't code. If you can't build a binary search and sort then it doesn't count ;)

I will never understand why some things are downvoted. Anyone with the power to do so knows that HTML is not a programming language and not indicative of hacker prowess.

Re: Codecademy and the Future of (Not) Learning to Code

#26

Post by cantbecool »

bmahmood wrote: post #22

I'm teaching myself to code right now, and have tried 3 different introductory courses/guides, including CodeAcademy. The problem I've faced with each one is I'd learn the same thing (methods, arrays, variables, conditional statements, etc) but was never able to piece together the practical use. I'd get what if/then clauses mean, and what arrays do, but never could grasp their broader functionality or use case in an…

Here's the little secret: Find something you want to create, and build it. It's as simple as that, bmahmood. You have to have that inner fire to build something.

If you're interested in web applications, check out http://ruby.railstutorial.org/ It's free and an excellent resource for a curious learner like yourself. At the end of it, you will have created a tangible web application that you could even show your friends.

Best of luck!

Re: Codecademy and the Future of (Not) Learning to Code

#27

Post by klaut »

tedkalaw wrote: post #4

I am kind of surprised by this, especially given all of the positive comments. It took Audrey's post to make me realize that if I were reading HN, a lot of those positive comments would be, well..technical people. So now I'm torn. My girlfriend is a graphic designer who wants to learn to code, and I'll probably have her give CodeAcademy a shot. And then maybe CodeSchool, since I have a subscription. How have the non-…

I thought myself to progrman in the Flash 5 days, because i really wanted to make interestign things with Actionscript. Javascript was easy after that, and after came PHP, and then Python and Java and Ruby and ... and after i knew programming well, I enrolled to the university to take my CS degree. But i have to say that it is easier to learn something (on your own or with help) if you have a context to apply it to. I already knew web design and doing html/css at the time so when i decided that maybe learning actionscript and javascript can be more useful, i already had ideas i wanted to make with it.

I think the author's idea to "learn some javascript because later maybe i can take some node.js jobs" will turn out not that easy, because she/he doesn't have a context to apply it to, or better, he/she should have an idea/problem that javascript would solve, and THEN try to learn bits around it.

Re: Codecademy and the Future of (Not) Learning to Code

#28

Post by alinajaf »

zds wrote: post #11

I'm one of the cofounders of Codecademy. I posted this on Audrey's blog, but I'm posting it here as well. Thanks! I’m glad you’re learning to code. In fact, I was in the same position a few years ago. Since then, I’ve tried everything - books, college classes, videos and more. For me, and for hundreds of people we’ve talked to, none of these traditional approaches, though useful for learning history or literature, he…

> If you ask most people what stopped them from reading their entire programming book (and we’ve talked to hundreds of people), it’s almost always that they aren’t motivated enough. In school, learning is motivated by report cards and teacher expectations. We hope we can build a motivational experience that pushes anyone to program - not just the stereotypical developer.

Badges and achievements are awesome when done right, but will only go so far with motivation. Real, intrinsic motivation will come from realizing that you can create something with the skills you've learned. If you could somehow capture this in Codecademy I think you could score a decisive advantage against the traditional tutorial/book learning model of learning to program.

Context: I'm currently working on a spaced repetition app that schedules Japanese vocab/sentence flashcards for you. While it has achievements/badges for behaviour that's conducive to your Japanese learning, it also finds native content on the internet that you're likely going to be able to read 90% of (based on the vocab cards you've done well on). Realizing that you can actually read Japanese content for native Japanese (i.e. you can actually _use_ the skill you're learning here) is the biggest rush of motivation I've experienced. It pushes you to go on and see how much more you could do, way more than any badge or achievement could.

Re: Codecademy and the Future of (Not) Learning to Code

#29

Post by Adam503 »

pixcavator wrote: post #17
zds wrote: post #11

I'm one of the cofounders of Codecademy. I posted this on Audrey's blog, but I'm posting it here as well. Thanks! I’m glad you’re learning to code. In fact, I was in the same position a few years ago. Since then, I’ve tried everything - books, college classes, videos and more. For me, and for hundreds of people we’ve talked to, none of these traditional approaches, though useful for learning history or literature, he…

>>My cofounder, Ryan, has spent the past couple of years helping developers at Columbia learn how to apply their theoretical computer science skills to actually programming. He’s taught hundreds of Columbia students the basics (and beyond). Take notes, Mr Khan.

Sorry, but students that get admitted to Columbia aren't real tough to motivate.

Sal Khan has already had millions of every kind of everyday students young and old chose to set aside their video games and sat down and work their math at KhanAcademy.org. Some nuns are starting sainthood talk for Sal at some Catholic schools.

Re: Codecademy and the Future of (Not) Learning to Code

#30

Post by Luyt »

alinajaf wrote: post #28
zds wrote: post #11

I'm one of the cofounders of Codecademy. I posted this on Audrey's blog, but I'm posting it here as well. Thanks! I’m glad you’re learning to code. In fact, I was in the same position a few years ago. Since then, I’ve tried everything - books, college classes, videos and more. For me, and for hundreds of people we’ve talked to, none of these traditional approaches, though useful for learning history or literature, he…

> If you ask most people what stopped them from reading their entire programming book (and we’ve talked to hundreds of people), it’s almost always that they aren’t motivated enough. In school, learning is motivated by report cards and teacher expectations. We hope we can build a motivational experience that pushes anyone to program - not just the stereotypical developer. Badges and achievements are awesome when done…

Sounds great, where can I find this app?
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