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Where in the linked article is Safari mentioned? This simply isn‘t possible at all on iOS as of now, and on macOS it requires registering an Apple developer account, as far as I understand.
They said iOS support will come next year. You don’t need an Apple developer account.
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Have you thought about not installing the apps and just using the website? I have yet to see a website where I wanted to install the app to view it, and have no idea what features would make me want to do that.
...which is why they're in favor of web push, which you're arguing against. You just made their point for them.
My point was maybe they should try just not installing the apps and not getting push notifications, etc.
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Have you thought about not installing the apps and just using the website? I have yet to see a website where I wanted to install the app to view it, and have no idea what features would make me want to do that.
Have you not enountered sites that app-wall you? Sites with useful content, such as Reddit - not allowing you to view the user-generated content unless you install their app? It sucks - but it exists.
Reddit has certainly asked me to download the app, but never forced me.
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Do they have to be? Who knows? But since 2007, Apple, Palm, Blackberry and Microsoft have all at one point or the other have said you don’t need native mobile apps and the web was good enough. It never was. Facebook tried the whole cross platform web app in a wrapper and decided it wasn’t good enough. Even while Google is extolling then virtues of its own cross platform tooling, it’s moving toward apps that use nativ…
Ahh yes, the infamous Facebook failure. Anyone can write a bad app. That's not necessarily a technology failure. But it's easier to blame the tech than to admit they did something badly. Everyone wants web apps to help sell hardware, right up until your app store grows into a money maker. Then the incentives are different. Regardless, today's mobile systems are much better, web browsers are much better. It is much ea…
1. Mobile apps convert higher than the web.
https://buildfire.com/mobile-apps-convert-higher/
2. Developers were clamoring for native apps each time. Not the mobile platforms. You act as if the modern web development environment isn’t a clusterfuck of complexity compared to modern IDEs for native apps.
3. Both Apple and Google have initiatives where you can have small instantly installable “applet” equivalents that make downloads fast and the apps are more responsive.
4. Cost is lower for the developer. But at the cost of a much worse user experience.
5. Browsers might have “higher backwards compatibility”. But the dependency hell and ever changing landscape of the front end framework of the week is real.
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They said iOS support will come next year. You don’t need an Apple developer account.
Yes – GP is claiming, as far as I understand it, that this is already the case, but their source does not support that claim, and I don't believe it's the case.
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Even simple apps like banking apps, AirBnB, and even Papa Johns are more responsive than their websites
That's because they're bad devs, not because webapps are inferior.
Or maybe it’s because either cross platform web apps are never as good as mobile apps or that the entire web development ecosystem is a clusterfuck of dependency hell, security vulnerabilities in dependencies, complexity, and “ooh shiny” new framework of the week?
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What capability/user experience does it gain by being an app?
it gains the ability to bypass ublock origin and other adblockers, for one. Not for benefit of the end users, but definitely Reddit gains from it.
Wow. I missed this a few days ago, but it seems like huge news for the web. Am I missing some important caveat or can web developers get excited about this? Apple’s long resistance to allowing ‘web push’ on iOS has held back PWA adoption. And they’ve obviously never admitted it, but this policy protected the hegemony of the App Store, and therefore Apple’s control over the whole ecosystem. The absence of web push on…
A few years back we had this same discussion orbiting around Service Workers. Here's a post from 2017 where the top comment argues that what's holding back the web is the lack of Service Workers in Safari: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=14489577 Apple shipped Service Workers in WebKit in 2021. Are web apps much better now than in 2017? Frankly it seems about the same. The best web apps are still exercises in mi…
https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Web/API/ServiceWork... shows support in Safari 11.1, shipped in 2018?
I know I'm a bit tangential, but what are some actually useful examples of push notifications for browsers? Every time I've seen them in action was with spam/clickbait, after someone accidentally subscribed and couldn't remove it.
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Ahh yes, the infamous Facebook failure. Anyone can write a bad app. That's not necessarily a technology failure. But it's easier to blame the tech than to admit they did something badly. Everyone wants web apps to help sell hardware, right up until your app store grows into a money maker. Then the incentives are different. Regardless, today's mobile systems are much better, web browsers are much better. It is much ea…
Well let’s see. 1. Mobile apps convert higher than the web. https://buildfire.com/mobile-apps-convert-higher/ 2. Developers were clamoring for native apps each time. Not the mobile platforms. You act as if the modern web development environment isn’t a clusterfuck of complexity compared to modern IDEs for native apps. 3. Both Apple and Google have initiatives where you can have small instantly installable “applet” eq…
2) Assumes facts not in evidence. This is not a universal opinion.
3) Still has the gate keepers, yet another platform to write for, etc etc. Lower friction might help vs PWAs, that's something at least.
4) Assumes facts not in evidence.
5) Showing your ignorance here. Front end has been stable for a while. Old stuff still works if you prefer it. Lots and lots of sites still do.
The mobile shill is real... There are reasons to pick mobile over something else. But just shilling the tool and showing your tech bigotry isn't a good way to pick solutions. I'm out.