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Former U.S. congressman, operative pleads guilty to election fraud charges
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Re: Former U.S. congressman, operative pleads guilty to election fraud charges
#112[flagged]
Location data is nowhere near fine-grained enough to determine if an individual has gone to a ballot dropbox vs. the coffee shop next to it. And dropboxes are intentionally placed in convenient high-traffic areas. I would be very suspicious of these fraud claims just on how unreliable the data naturally is. Besides, if you really wanted to rig elections with mail ballots, it's way more effective to throw away ballots…
The qualification was device ids that went to 10+ dropboxes, comparing the routes and stops, not the location point by itself.
For your explanation to be valid they would have to have stopped at 10 specific locations each by a dropbox. Those devices did those routes 30~ times each on avg.
Those routes include exiting off of highways, going down specific streets, then going to the next dropbox in a specific area. All at 3-5am when businesses were closed.
edit: to downvoters, please discuss the facts of the location analysis or voice what you're in disagreement about.
Re: Former U.S. congressman, operative pleads guilty to election fraud charges
#113[flagged]
Nixon showed us it can and does go all the way to the top. "All the President's Men" is worth a watch to see how cheap it is to buy the country. The Committee to Reelect the President brought the Democratic frontrunner to tears in public, and eliminated him from the election, with a measly $3,000,000. Power can be bought at a cheap discount, and only "democratic norms" seem to protect us from this behavior most of the time.
Re: Former U.S. congressman, operative pleads guilty to election fraud charges
#114Earlier quoted context omitted.
For some reason progressives are against voter ID laws. I've said that before and will say it again: Most of EU requires ID to vote. I will support Republicans that want to do this. It is sad to bring EU in the picture to convince progressives but it is a magic word that somehow brings logic and reason. We shouldn't have to say "They do it in EU, so it must be good". People have stopped thinking for themselves. Anyth…
> For some reason progressives are against voter ID laws. It’s a barrier preventing citizens from exercising constitutional rights. The need isn’t clearly demonstrated to justify the restriction. Voter ID laws have different outcomes based on economic status. It’s especially difficult for poor people to exercise their rights. > People have stopped thinking for themselves. Or maybe someone else thought of something yo…
I think that the progressive default argument on this topic is pretty transparent BS. If it's too hard for some people to get an ID, make it easier for everyone to get an ID. Don't open up elections to an obvious fraud vector.
Re: Former U.S. congressman, operative pleads guilty to election fraud charges
#115Re: Former U.S. congressman, operative pleads guilty to election fraud charges
#116Earlier quoted context omitted.
> For some reason progressives are against voter ID laws. It’s a barrier preventing citizens from exercising constitutional rights. The need isn’t clearly demonstrated to justify the restriction. Voter ID laws have different outcomes based on economic status. It’s especially difficult for poor people to exercise their rights. > People have stopped thinking for themselves. Or maybe someone else thought of something yo…
> It’s a barrier for poor people to exercise their rights. This is delusional. ID is required for so many daily activities and the price of an ID (if they charge for it) is less than $10.
In Ohio, it's much easier to vote with a drivers license than with a state ID card. People that are disabled or can't afford a car have state ID cards.
Also, poll taxes are unconstitutional in the US. $10 is more than $0.
Re: Former U.S. congressman, operative pleads guilty to election fraud charges
#117They make it sound so simple: Bribe the Judge of Elections who oversees everything. Dilute the vote tallies by using the voting machines to increment the votes for specific candidates. Certify that the fake results are correct. Lie if anybody asks. This person did this with 2 separate judges. Why is it so easy?
> Dilute the vote tallies by using the voting machines to increment the votes for specific candidates > Why is it so easy? I don't know, it doesn't seem easy to me. I mean, it seems like the result of a ton of long-term planning to implement processes that allow each instance of this to be easy. But the fight against electronic voting machines was fierce, and took a long time. We lost, by the way.
Having some familiarity with the Pennsylvania election machinery specifically, there is nothing about this story that required (or would have been stopped by the absence of) electronic voting machines.
If it was the old iVotronic system, there would be no ballot to check against (the vote was held in the machine memory in redundant locations), but that's no protection against the machine being activated illegitimately and the judge of elections entering illegitimate votes. In the new system, the machines are just tabulators and physical "SAT-style" fill-the-oval vote cards are used as ballots, but again, there's nothing stopping a judge of elections from filling out a pile of invalid ballots and entering them into the machine if the other team members (majority and minority inspector, and the clerks of election) have been bribed to look the other way. In fact, the judge would have to do that, because the fraud will be obvious if the total count of record doesn't match the total count of paper ballots in the box... But structurally, this is equivalent to just activating the iVotronic machine several additional times to cast fraudulent digital-only ballots.
The nature of the fraud here is simple, old-fashioned stuffing the ballot box, and the only protection against that is physically barring access to the hardware (be it a computer or a pine box with a padlock), which is incompatible with the duties of the judge of elections.
Re: Former U.S. congressman, operative pleads guilty to election fraud charges
#118This person is actually a repeat offender with a history of abusing his office. https://www.inquirer.com/news/ozzie-myers-convicted-abscam-p...
The important question: is he an outlier, or the norm?
Re: Former U.S. congressman, operative pleads guilty to election fraud charges
#119Wow. I hadn't thought of him since Abscam ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abscam ).
American Hustle is based on this operation FWIW.
Re: Former U.S. congressman, operative pleads guilty to election fraud charges
#120Earlier quoted context omitted.
No. I'm advocating a civil discourse in which people evaluate the pros and cons of different approaches without resorting to racial attacks. I'm advocating that people should be encouraged to ask questions, like why does it take so long for the US to count ballots without getting into partisan bullshit.
America has degenerated into sectarian politics, and in such a system you can’t have a civil discourse about anything without “resorting to racial attacks.” I went to go see the candidates in Iowa for the 2020 Dem primary I was amazed by their talent (Elizabeth Warren particularly) for injecting race into literally every issue.
Wedge politics. As old as time. Find an emotional issue to carve out a group of people. Then craft a statement that appeals to that group. It makes your campaign feel more personal to them. When you get elected, fail to implement anything you promised, and blame it on the other party.