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EU reaches deal to make USB-C a common charger for most electronic devices

engadget.com

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Re: EU reaches deal to make USB-C a common charger for most electronic devices

#731

Post by afiori »

theplumber wrote: post #287
samatman wrote: post #269

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not a citizen of the EU, so your various centrally-planned interventions in the world economy affect me without any possibility of representation. It leaves me hoping your economy becomes much smaller so Asia can start ignoring it. Or reform I guess, the vote is yours, not mine.

Imagine different gasoline plugs...that would be stupid, isnt't it? Or different fuel formula for different car models or different AC sockets in the same house... Also I'm not sure why you hold Asia so dear. You may soon get some centrally planned standards from China in the EV market and not only(i.e online services such tiktok)

> different AC sockets in the same house

cries in Italian...

Re: EU reaches deal to make USB-C a common charger for most electronic devices

#732

Post by GuB-42 »

Ekaros wrote: post #624
bsnal wrote: post #612

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Seems like history of computing goes against this

PC and x86 took us pretty far... And that was mostly carried on interoperability... I doubt we would have gotten to technology being as ubiquitous as it is without it.

Also, the internet itself.

Re: EU reaches deal to make USB-C a common charger for most electronic devices

#733

Post by hwbehrens »

notJim wrote: post #560
leadingthenet wrote: post #506

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Let's say the USB consortium releases USB-D with input from Apple, Google, and many other stakeholders [...] If you have to make such an argument, you've already lost. Innovation, particularly disruptive and / or breakthrough innovation, does not happen by committee, no matter how many times over history people tried deluding themselves into thinking that it does. So no, it's not fine.

It's very strange to read this comment on article about USB, which has been developed by committee from the beginning. To me it seems quite innovative, and arguably disruptive to have a single standard for all these things. Maybe USB doesn't clear your personal bar, but then why worry about this at all?

I can't be sure, but my interpretation of the parent's comment is that the USB-IF would never have thought to work on USB-C at all until Lightning's release two years earlier. The whole forehead-slapping moment of cables that didn't need to be flipped was a pretty big divergence from the USB-A, -B, mini B, micro B, etc. that has prevailed previously. The kernel of the argument being, Apple's "innovation" by rejecting the status quo is what allowed for the (eventual) development of the USB-C standard.

This is actually fairly common in Apple-land, now that I look:

- ADB (1986) to PS2 (1987) to USB-A (1996) for HID

- Firewire (1995) to USB 2.0 (2000) to Firewire 800 (2002) to USB 3.0 (2008) for data transfer

- VGA (1987) to ADC (1998) to DVI (1999) for video

A lot of the connectors they proposed are now lost to the mists of time, but I can at least understand the argument that some of these changes were plausibly driven by Apple's rejection of the then-standard in favor of some new benefit (faster speeds, better UX), which lasted only until a new standard was developed to incorporate that benefit, and the process repeats again.

Re: EU reaches deal to make USB-C a common charger for most electronic devices

#734

Post by ThatPlayer »

kalleboo wrote: post #82
2000UltraDeluxe wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The idea's nice. I'll still have about 30 unusable micro-USB chargers lying around, though.

Interesting, I've never seen a charger with microUSB permanently attached, all my chargers have a USB-A port where you can change the cable. In any case, you can just stick tiny plug adapters on all your chargers. https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07G54XXZZ/

Off the top of my head, the Official Raspberry Pi Power Supplies, for both the microUSB and USB-C variants are permanently attached cables.

Re: EU reaches deal to make USB-C a common charger for most electronic devices

#735

Post by Barrin92 »

usr1106 wrote: post #674
Barrin92 wrote: post #649

Earlier quoted context omitted.

who needs breakthrough innovation for a charger? It's like the C++ programming language, I just want it to work everywhere. Programming languages have been designed by committee just fine.

That's a weird argument. What would you say if EU demanded us to stop programming in Python, Rust, bash and mandate that only C++ must used? No, I have no problem with the USB-C mandate. But the analogy seems weird.

>What would you say if EU demanded us to stop programming in Python, Rust, bash and mandate that only C++ must used?

I support the idea that regulatory bodies like the EU create stronger software standards in safety critical applications in particular so that software 'engineering' actually starts to deserve that label so I have no problem with a good faith version of that take.

Re: EU reaches deal to make USB-C a common charger for most electronic devices

#736

Post by dreamcompiler »

phkahler wrote: post #710
dreamcompiler wrote: post #703

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I's absolutely true that Tesla's EV connector is better than CCS, and it's a pity that Tesla lost that battle. But it's also true that USB-C with PD is better than the alternatives in its space so occasionally the committees get things right.

>> I's absolutely true that Tesla's EV connector is better than CCS, and it's a pity that Tesla lost that battle. Currently working at a company that makes CCS chargers. Can confirm the standard is an absolute shit show, the cables are heavy, and the plugs are a giant pain in the ass. But hey, it's the standard so that's what we make. Oh, and why TF do we have a PowerLine Communication chip to talk to the vehicle ove…

Tesla's connector uses CAN over signal wires, and it uses the same power pins for both AC and DC which makes the connector light and sleek. If you think VHS is worse than Betamax, CCS is more worse than Tesla's connector.

Re: EU reaches deal to make USB-C a common charger for most electronic devices

#737

Post by tradertef »

monocasa wrote: post #398
mmastrac wrote: post #315

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is the truth of the matter. Apple has been dragging their feet on switching away from lightning. Why? No idea. It's a much slower standard, and puts the wearing parts in the port instead of the cable. USB-C is designed by committee, sure, but the port itself is better than lightning in nearly every consumer metric there is.

Apple gets a patent license fee on every lightning cord. If they switch to a standard they didn't patent, they lose a revenue stream.

That is one of the reasons for Apple. Another one is to be able to sell their own cables to consumers at a premium price.

Re: EU reaches deal to make USB-C a common charger for most electronic devices

#738

Post by Gigachad »

sitzkrieg wrote: post #717
mlok wrote: post #675

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I really hope Matrix bridges will help bring back some sanity on this front.

the performance is too bad

The bridges are not horrible. But they aren’t super reliable. I have seen them go down for a few days once, generally be a bit slow, forward messages out of order, etc.

The free matrix.org server is also overloaded. The paid server is much faster.

Re: EU reaches deal to make USB-C a common charger for most electronic devices

#739

Post by sydd »

kennywinker wrote: post #715
phkahler wrote: post #702

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>> If it comes with being able to buy a $5 cable to act as a charge, I don't see how people could complain. Even better, just use the old cable from your old device since they won't be designing a new one every other year.

As far as a I know, in the history of smartphones - which I'd say starts in 2007 with the launch of the iPhone - there have only really been 4 (or maybe 5) connectors used on widely sold phones: 1. Apple 30pin "iPod" connector 2. Apple Lightning connector 3. Mini USB (I don't think this ever appeared on anything but blackberries and cheapo flip phones?) 4. Micro USB 5. USB-C So, while I agree that cable changes are a…

Except that the current USB-C situation is a mess, and this regulation plans to solve this.

I got a pretty expensive HP monitor for work from my company that connects via USB-C (and can charge my Mac). IT has sworn me to not loose its USB-C cable because for some unknown reasons it refuses to work with other cables, it costs >$100 and is constantly out of stock.

Re: EU reaches deal to make USB-C a common charger for most electronic devices

#740

Post by bsder »

dfox wrote: post #631
notJim wrote: post #560

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's very strange to read this comment on article about USB, which has been developed by committee from the beginning. To me it seems quite innovative, and arguably disruptive to have a single standard for all these things. Maybe USB doesn't clear your personal bar, but then why worry about this at all?

From time to time Intel's marketing tries to sell the idea that USB was invented by this one Intel engineer. Somewhat obviously that is not true. On the other hand if you compare USB 1.0 to 1.1 it is quite obvious that real implementation experience and throwing out artifacts of the design by committee was quite important for the success.

> Somewhat obviously that is not true.

Especially since I know that several people at Digital Equipment Corporation had to do the signal integrity analysis for Intel for the original USB standard.

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